quote:

Originally posted by Seric Blatant unexuseable abuse of a sentient, conscious creature. Have more respect for the world around you.

Like there aren't enough rats on this planet already. It's not like they're the cleanest of animals either, they're the cause of many plagues this world has been through.

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quote:

Originally posted by Seric Blatant unexuseable abuse of a sentient, conscious creature. Have more respect for the world around you.

by getting to know the complexity and bueaty of how a living creature works is having respect for the amazing processes that make life

I've dissected a worm and a cow's heart before... Worm stunk.

quote:

Originally posted by montie by getting to know the complexity and bueaty of how a living creature works is having respect for the amazing processes that make life

I'm not saying you're a dispicable human, I'm just pointing to the eagerness our country lends towards vivisection. I know where yuo're coming from, but since your forefathers have already gone once into the breach, you fortunately for the rat do not have any true necessity to do such a thing. Even if it was killed before you got it.. You, by finishing the assignment are contributing to the demand for vivisection.

and no school could tell me I'd fail the assignment if I did NOT contribute to something like that, that's complete bullshit. I sure they'd let be substiture with a .. uhh Rat Thesis or some sort.


"Like there aren't enough rats on this planet already. It's not like they're the cleanest of animals either, they're the cause of many plagues this world has been through."

I'll mock the validity of that statements ability to hold water.. "Like there aren't enough humans on this planet already".

I just don't believe that animals are on this planet for our abuse and explitation.

Not to mention, say it was absolutely necessary. How about dissicting a rat and projecting it on a screen in a lecture rather than alot everyone their own life-toy

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Originally posted by Seric I'll mock the validity of that statements ability to hold water.. "Like there aren't enough humans on this planet already". I just don't believe that animals are on this planet for our abuse and explitation.

I knew you were going to come back with that "Like there aren't enough humans on this planet already." statement.

Btw, are you a vegetarian or PETA activist? Take no offence I'm just wondering...

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Originally posted by TeKnoHe@d2025 I knew you were going to come back with that "Like there aren't enough humans on this planet already." statement. Btw, are you a vegetarian or PETA activist? Take no offence I'm just wondering...

I had to, it was both an easy and thorough point.

Yes I'm vegetarian. I'm buddhist and do not believe in harming any living creature. I'm no saint. I try my very best to avoid contributing to the suffering of animals and people alike. I even partially adopted this philosophy because I knew that if I ever confronted certain individuals in person, I would indeed kill them, and I decided that I needed to find a deeper compassion for all living things, even those whom I may hate, and in the process i came upon many realizations about this culture that I had previously looked right past, such as out outlook on animals as expendable assets for our every consuption. The torture of livestock and poultry is abhorrent. Especially for such intelligent creatures. It's generally accepted by many sceintists that chickens and cattle have intellectual capacities that meet and in some cases exceed that of dogs and cats.

I sympathize with PETA, yes. As well as ELF, and ALF. It is a popular idea that such organizations endanger people over animals and the enviroment, but this is not true, as the premise of such groups are to NOT harm any living creature, and are 100% nonviolent. Violence is classified as inflicting injury or harm in living things. Some people who act on behalf of earth and animal liberation groups use vandalism, but not violence, however sympathy for vandals is up to the individual

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Alright thanks for clearing that up, I respect other people's point of views as long as they can see where I'm coming from as well.

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quote:

Originally posted by Seric The torture of livestock and poultry is abhorrent. Especially for such intelligent creatures.

I'll have to agree with that... i came across a 'Vegetarian' pamphlet once.... pretty ugly stuff...

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quote:

Originally posted by Seric I'm not saying you're a dispicable human, I'm just pointing to the eagerness our country lends towards vivisection. I know where yuo're coming from, but since your forefathers have already gone once into the breach, you fortunately for the rat do not have any true necessity to do such a thing. Even if it was killed before you got it.. You, by finishing the assignment are contributing to the demand for vivisection. and no school could tell me I'd fail the assignment if I did NOT contribute to something like that, that's complete bullshit. I sure they'd let be substiture with a .. uhh Rat Thesis or some sort. "Like there aren't enough rats on this planet already. It's not like they're the cleanest of animals either, they're the cause of many plagues this world has been through." I'll mock the validity of that statements ability to hold water.. "Like there aren't enough humans on this planet already". I just don't believe that animals are on this planet for our abuse and explitation. Not to mention, say it was absolutely necessary. How about dissicting a rat and projecting it on a screen in a lecture rather than alot everyone their own life-toy

I agree with you fully on the point where you mention that schools should have an option for people who do not wish to partake in a disseciton.
But I do think that doing a dissection is the best ways to learn about anatomy and the structures of whatever type of animal you are doing the disection on. Maybe this may not be so important for a highschool biology class, but i think it is of utter inportance for an anatomy class especially for those studying biology or the health sciences.

and i agree on your points on the silly statements about "there are too many rats in the world" and whatnot.

I am also against the unnecesary abuse of animals or the unecesary destruction of their habitats.

I definatly respect what you said in your second post as to being a buddhist and vegitarian.
And I sympathize with PETA on some issues. I am no vegitarian though. I am not for the mass "farming" of animals where numerous cattle are coralled close together fed geneticly engineered feed and pumped full of growth hormones and antibiotics.
I'm very picky when it comes to my meat and would never eat the shit they pass off for hamburger at a fast food restaurant. (unless i'm really really hungry and have no where else to go )
I'd love for farmers to raise animals much more "naturally" in the sense that they have much smaller stocks which have relativly long lives and have large pastures to roam and eat the grass.
But the reason this is not the case is because of economic issues. anyway, i don't want to keep blabbering

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Originally posted by Tranex02 I'll have to agree with that... i came across a 'Vegetarian' pamphlet once.... pretty ugly stuff...

Yeah, I think that chicken is the worst.. Sometimes they miss the killing machine and get thrown into poiling oil to soften the skin for feather removal, and survive just long enough to get their feathers torn out of their bodies and bleed to death. They also don't give them enough to live, and feed them so horribly that they become so fat their own legs break from underneath them. They're even so close that they de-beak them to they dont kill eachother. De-Beaking consists of a machine that literally busts it off with a blunt chunk of metal, and then they cauterize it. Alive of course.

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I've disected a salomon, octopus (small eight-legged), chicken and a crawfish. I have to say that the chicken was something special *smile*.
And it was already dead, they didn't kill it just for experiment.
I'm pretty shaky with my hands so I don't think I have a future in this profession though
Never liked this stuff when I was younger, still I'm not very much into it. But if you guys like it, then good for you

quote:

Originally posted by montie I agree with you fully on the point where you mention that schools should have an option for people who do not wish to partake in a disseciton. But I do think that doing a dissection is the best ways to learn about anatomy and the structures of whatever type of animal you are doing the disection on. Maybe this may not be so important for a highschool biology class, but i think it is of utter inportance for an anatomy class especially for those studying biology or the health sciences. and i agree on your points on the silly statements about "there are too many rats in the world" and whatnot. I am also against the unnecesary abuse of animals or the unecesary destruction of their habitats. I definatly respect what you said in your second post as to being a buddhist and vegitarian. And I sympathize with PETA on some issues. I am no vegitarian though. I am not for the mass "farming" of animals where numerous cattle are coralled close together fed geneticly engineered feed and pumped full of growth hormones and antibiotics. I'm very picky when it comes to my meat and would never eat the shit they pass off for hamburger at a fast food restaurant. (unless i'm really really hungry and have no where else to go ) I'd love for farmers to raise animals much more "naturally" in the sense that they have much smaller stocks which have relativly long lives and have large pastures to roam and eat the grass. But the reason this is not the case is because of economic issues. anyway, i don't want to keep blabbering

Hey, Even remaining a meateater, would it not ba a dignified enough request to meat companies to provide atleast some basic comforts to the animals? I'd feel alot better about having meat occasionally if i knew that it wasn't so dismal.

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