quote:

Originally posted by imokruok That doesn't mean they're not Jordanians. Jordan is smart in not wanting them back. Who wants to accept a few million poor, poorly educated, sometimes violent people back across the river? But ethnically, that's their proper place.

Sorry but what the hell is that supposed to mean? They should fuck off back to Jordan? They've lived there all their lives, why should they move? What would be the reaction of you said that about Black people in whatever country, that ethnically, Africa should be their "proper place"? And add to that that there were nowhere near as many Jews living in Palestine before 1948...should they go back to Europe or Russia?

quote:

Originally posted by George Smiley Sorry but what the hell is that supposed to mean? They should fuck off back to Jordan? They've lived there all their lives, why should they move? What would be the reaction of you said that about Black people in whatever country, that ethnically, Africa should be their "proper place"? And add to that that there were nowhere near as many Jews living in Palestine before 1948...should they go back to Europe or Russia?

Using your logic, you would then have to accept that 'Palestinians' living in Lebanon and Jordan have no right of return, as they 'ived their there whole lives'

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at this entire thread! Good point nic

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quote:

Originally posted by Yoepus Using your logic, you would then have to accept that 'Palestinians' living in Lebanon and Jordan have no right of return, as they 'ived their there whole lives'

and that only proves his point. that you can't think like that

Palestinians did have unity and you can see that in the 1834 revolt against the Egyptians. There is a Palestinian people. They DID refer to the land as Palestine since Arabs arrived there in the 7th century. They're not gonna get up and leave because someone was absent for 2000 years and came back and said get off.

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Theodore Herzl, founder of the World Zionist Organization: "Spirit the penniless population across the frontier by denying it employment... Both the process of expropriation and the removal of the poor must be carried out discreetly and circumspectly."

This whole debate is pointless, since theoretical. It's got nothing to do with the current reality: some 4 million people claiming to BE a people and fighting for their own land (if not more). There's nothing that will change that fact, surely not a theoretical contra-argument against their alleged national identity.

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quote:

Originally posted by TranceGiant This whole debate is pointless, since theoretical. It's got nothing to do with the current reality: some 4 million people claiming to BE a people and fighting for their own land (if not more). There's nothing that will change that fact, surely not a theoretical contra-argument against their alleged national identity.

despite having to agree with you in this instnace, I have to point this out:

Millions had believed in communism up until 1991, a purely theoretical, rhetorical exercies proved communsim wrong with the fall of Russia, and now we have millions no longer claiming to be communists. When people realized, theoretically that communism was a delusion, they stopped being communist.

I believe peope, if they lose their theoretical identity tend to lose their actually identity. Although I don't see that happening in this case, I see it happening in the similar case with pan-Arab fundamentalism.

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