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Originally posted by Inertia other than that, when you have a 4/4 record playing, and you monitor and match up your breaks, how do you EQ it in? just slapping the fader upwards can sometimes sound pretty good, but how do you guys go seamlessly into breaks?

Well it depends on the track, really, but I usually have the bass on the breaks track killed until the very end. I slowly bring in the mids/highs during the outro of the 4/4 tune and at an appropriate time I just kill the bass of the 4/4 tune and put the bass up on the other track.

One track I like to use to make the transition from trance to breaks is Hampshire & Nysse feat. Nikita - Eternal Voices (Tiësto Alternative Breaks Mix) because it has a beatless intro, just some perc loops playing... then after a bit it suddenly booms in at full force. It can sound abrupt since the intro is relatively short but it's great if you time it right

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it's tough doing a subtle breaks mix out of a straight beat. i mean, it's clearly noticeable when the highs and lows are hitting of the straight beat. it is possible if you slowly introduce the different frequencies. you can usually bring the highs and some high mids in pretty quick and bring up the bass or swap them at the end of a phrase. you can get it pretty smooth that way...

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Originally posted by 3xx3r7 I can't seem to get it right. Is it even possible? I always trainwreck, 'cause the beats are so different.

By all means learn, but I wouldn't do it on a dancefloor.

Just practice it and learn to feel the beat of the record and get to know where there should be beats even if you cant hear them. In time you will learn the count in your head. Use the force if you will...

Cheers
Nem

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I gotta say adding breaks to a already good trance set is awesome, I'm all about mixing in breaks now, it adds a real edge to the set, I don't find it hard at all, I find it MUCH easier for some reason, and to make a transition go from a 4/4 beat into a breaks track sounding absolutely amazing, the best thing is to make sure there harmonically the same, and then bring it in depending on the energy of the track that your mixing out from, if its mellow do a slow mix, but if its filled with energy, then mix it like the track has just gone into a breakdown, then when you complete the transition, people will be like WTF?, whered that track go, works beautifully.

But this is just my advice and way of doing it, take it or leave it.

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Originally posted by tranceDJ I suggest you buy some tracks that have the standard 4/4 beat but then have a part with a breakbeat (ex. 'push - strange world)...then you can beatmatch the incoming track when there's the regular beat but then it will also match up with the breakbeat part. This is a good way to practice at least. It's also important to use the highhat when mixing breaks with trance. If you match the highhats then the beats should match as well.

i am pretty sure breaks are 4/4 aswell.. just broken..

Jay

it might also be easier to bring in the beat of the breaks song during the breakdown of the trance track. let it play for a measure or two without any beat and having the highs and mids mixed on the two tracks, then brop in the beat of the breaks track.

i have tried to mix breaks (even though i hate breaks) with trance and never had any sucess.

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Originally posted by veezee i am pretty sure breaks are 4/4 aswell.. just broken.. Jay

True that.

Nem

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I agree that dropping a breaks tune during a trance set can do wonders, and I regularly drop some breaks during a long set.

In shorter sets however, breaks sorta have this 'reducing the pace' feeling, and I'll drop it depending on the flow of the set.

I started out mixing trance + breaks by using Hybrid remixes of songs which usually has his trademark trancey/breaks sound which I like, and fits well with trancey songs.

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quote:

Originally posted by rafale I agree that dropping a breaks tune during a trance set can do wonders, and I regularly drop some breaks during a long set. In shorter sets however, breaks sorta have this 'reducing the pace' feeling, and I'll drop it depending on the flow of the set. I started out mixing trance + breaks by using Hybrid remixes of songs which usually has his trademark trancey/breaks sound which I like, and fits well with trancey songs.

In line with using Hybrid mixes, BT also has some tracks that would fit well. The one coming to mind right now is the Dylan Rhymes mix of Force of Gravity. There is a great part 40 seconds into the track were you can cut out the first song's 4/4 and cut in the breakbeat of FOG.

Now, the best way to mix the standard 4/4 over breaks or vice versa is to use a musical technique known as subdivision. When you are normally mixing, subconsciously you are always counting

"1... 2... 3... 4..."

etc. You are counting quarter notes. The first step is to count double what you normally would, something like

"1 . & . 2 . & . 3 . & . 4 . & ."

(literally in your head, "One and two and three and four and") for each measure. These are the eighth notes. This way you are counting the off (or syncopated) beats of the measure. When this is comfortable, split it up once more in the same way, and you will end up with:

"1 + & + 2 + & + 3 + & + 4 + & +"

(or in your head, "1 e an ah 2 e an ah 3 e an ah 4 e an ah"). Now we are at sixteenth notes, where all of the stuff that makes breakbeats fun and exciting lie.

Once you can subdivide to this degree, you simply subdivide the breaks track you are mixing into. This way you can see where the beat structure lies respective to the beat structure of your trance (or any other 4/4 track). Put one on top of each other, and then you will see how they both will fit together like a key into a lock.

**NOTE** Make sure you are mixing 4/4 into another even numbered time signature to start. I would even go so far as to say only 4/4, but sometimes you can get away with 2/4, and not worry about the phrasing. If you wish to mix songs in 4/4 with songs in 3/4 or 6/8, subdivision is essential, because the measures will only line up every 12 measures, and the phrases will only line up every 3 to 6 to 12 phrases; 8/16/32 measure phrases, respectively.

This takes a great deal of practice to do right, but this is the same method a symphony orchestra can stay together, even with one section playing in 5/4, one is 6/8, and the rest in 4/4.

Who knew classical training would come in handy?

Last edited by Solkanar512 on Jul-17-2004 at 10:28

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Originally posted by Solkanar512 **NOTE** Make sure you are mixing 4/4 into another even numbered time signature to start. I would even go so far as to say only 4/4, but sometimes you can get away with 2/4, and not worry about the phrasing. If you wish to mix songs in 4/4 with songs in 3/4 or 6/8, subdivision is essential, because the measures will only line up every 12 measures, and the phrases will only line up every 3 to 6 to 12 phrases; 8/16/32 measure phrases, respectively. This takes a great deal of practice to do right, but this is the same method a symphony orchestra can stay together, even with one section playing in 5/4, one is 6/8, and the rest in 4/4. Who knew classical training would come in handy?

Hrm... how many trance/breaks tracks have you actually found that weren't in 4/4?

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Originally posted by Mr.Mystery Hrm... how many trance/breaks tracks have you actually found that weren't in 4/4?

To be honest, I haven't found any, but that could easily be due to my naiveté. You have to also remember, there is a metric assload of dance music written in 3/4.

Waltzing, anyone?