quote:

Originally posted by Jayx1 Exactly... the government shouldnt get involved IN EVERYTHING. If parents want to expose their kids to whatever its their business.

So you're saying it's ok for parents to expose their kids to something that is harmful?

Hmmm....makes you think though.

Ok, so everyone basically agrees that smoking within the closed confines of a car with kids present is basically a dumb thing to do. So it should be banned. Fine, I agree. But we don't need a law for this. It should be common sense. Aside from the fact that this law is almost unenforceable, it also opens up a can of worms, because what's next ?

No smoking inside your house as well ? Cause surely the same logic applies if you are smoking in your living room with your kids sitting in front of the TV. They are exposed to the same smoke related risks that caused the ban on smoking in public places.

It's a slippery slope once you start telling people what they should be doing in their private space, because you're basically telling people that they're stupid, and don't have the common sense to protect the people they love the most.

When it comes to public spaces, i agree...a ban makes sense because most people won't care about the wellbeing of others. But to ban smoking in their OWN cars is just ridiculous.

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"Hell is full of musical amateurs; music is the brandy of the damned."
~ George Bernard Shaw

you know, its a law hard to enforce, like catching people with no seat belt on.

BUT, almost everyone wears his seatbelt because 1- they're affraid of getting a ticket and 2- because they now know that it'll save their life.

Same logic applies to this case too, imho.

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quote:

Originally posted by Jayx1 PS: im willing to bet that if someone smacks their kid in public now they get sent to jail. The government is giving parents less and less say in how to raise their kids. PPS: Most kids deserve a good smack once in a while. It made me turn out well.

For once, I'm in full agreement. Nothing wrong with a well placed smack once in a while when the kid needs to be disciplined. Of course, nothing too severe, and it should always be followed by an explaination of why the punishment was administered.

I was smacked on more then a few occasions when i acted the brat (always by my mom - i guess she was the bad cop in my family)...nothing wrong with it at all. I understand now, as i did when i started growing up, that it was fully deserved. If anything, i believe it's the reason why i still respect my parents and never pulled some of the shit i've heard kids doing these days.

No smacking in public though...that just humilates the kid, it does nothing as far as instilling discipline. You can always use stern words of admonishment for that.

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"Hell is full of musical amateurs; music is the brandy of the damned."
~ George Bernard Shaw

If you read it carefully the guy says "...there should be no smoking WHEN TRANSPORTING CHILDREN"

Are you REALLY against a law that would help prevent retard parents from giving their kids lung cancer?

And as for this precedent thing, you're arguing a "slippery slope", which is a fallacy (look it up). Also, it might surprise you, but the state has been reglating your personal space for a while now *GASP*

Yeah that's right, for example when you wanted to buy smokes or alcohol when underage the state slapped your teenage pimply ass down. And guess what, those precidents have been around for a loooong time. So chill out, TO is not turning into a totalitarian state.

quote:

Originally posted by Cal If you read it carefully the guy says "...there should be no smoking WHEN TRANSPORTING CHILDREN" Are you REALLY against a law that would help prevent retard parents from giving their kids lung cancer? And as for this precedent thing, you're arguing a "slippery slope", which is a fallacy (look it up). Also, it might surprise you, but the state has been reglating your personal space for a while now *GASP* Yeah that's right, for example when you wanted to buy smokes or alcohol when underage the state slapped your teenage pimply ass down. And guess what, those precidents have been around for a loooong time. So chill out, TO is not turning into a totalitarian state.

It's different when you're a minor...you're young and dumb. Of course someone needs to regulate your pimply ass. If your parents can't put the hammer down, then the Guv needs to step in and do it by making it illegal to do certain things like buy cigs and booze.

Should parents refrain from smoking when they are transporting kids -- of course they should, and i bet most parents do. Does it need to be made into a law. No, because it does set a precedent...because then the reason for banning smoking in a household with kids is the next logical step. Think about it. It's basically the same thing. Even if you smoke in a different room to where your kids are, they can still argue it puts the kids at risk. The question isn't what safe for kids, i think the point has been made pretty clear that second hand smoke is injurious to health, but lets give people who credit here. They aren't completely stupid either.

I wouldn't smoke with the windows up if my kids were in the backseat. The same way i wouldn't blow smoke in my kids face if we were sitting next to each other on the couch. I don't need a law to tell me these things.

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"Hell is full of musical amateurs; music is the brandy of the damned."
~ George Bernard Shaw

quote:

Originally posted by habsfan So you're saying it's ok for parents to expose their kids to something that is harmful?

Not necissarily but at the same time the state shouldnt be legistlating everything to death either. If they want to go after parents who smoke near their kids there are existing neglect laws they can use rather than set a dangerous precendent by violating the right to do as you choose in your personal space. Smoking is not illegal and until it is the government had no right to dictate how one uses tobacco on PRIVATE PERSONAL PROPERTY.

IF they win this they can extend this to all kinds of behaviours on private property "for our own good" and thats what scares me.

quote:

Originally posted by Kytracid Hmmm....makes you think though. Ok, so everyone basically agrees that smoking within the closed confines of a car with kids present is basically a dumb thing to do. So it should be banned. Fine, I agree. But we don't need a law for this. It should be common sense. Aside from the fact that this law is almost unenforceable, it also opens up a can of worms, because what's next ? No smoking inside your house as well ? Cause surely the same logic applies if you are smoking in your living room with your kids sitting in front of the TV. They are exposed to the same smoke related risks that caused the ban on smoking in public places. It's a slippery slope once you start telling people what they should be doing in their private space, because you're basically telling people that they're stupid, and don't have the common sense to protect the people they love the most. When it comes to public spaces, i agree...a ban makes sense because most people won't care about the wellbeing of others. But to ban smoking in their OWN cars is just ridiculous.

Exactly...

quote:

Originally posted by malek you know, its a law hard to enforce, like catching people with no seat belt on. BUT, almost everyone wears his seatbelt because 1- they're affraid of getting a ticket and 2- because they now know that it'll save their life. Same logic applies to this case too, imho.

Im against the seatbelt law too. If you are dumb enough not to wear one its your own damned fault if you go through the windshield.

Hopefully parents won't smoke around there kids - but if I rent a car and wanna have a smoke then I will. - but if there are non - smokers in the car i am generally a little more polite with NO smoking - it's all about control!

the governement can't control who smokes in there cars - only th popel smoking should -


mindyou growing up - my fatehr would be a true prick and smoke all the time in the van or cat with the WINdows up! asshole - that's probably why - my mother got cancer and died and why my sisters and I smoke! yes, I tried quiting, didn't work - a little bit of a stressful time to quit - so I started again - ( - but oh well - shall stop again when i find an apartment.


I also remeber getting so dizzy on road trips - and the reason he wouldn't roll down the damn windows was b/c he didn't like the whistle that the wind would make or what ever sound it is. He has hurt me for life!






only my opinion... Which always counts!

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DALLAS STAR ™ °¤§£¤y°

Treat people as if they are what they ought to be and you may help them to become what they are capable of being.

Not every minor is dumb, and not every adult is bright.

Come on! In a world where people sue corporations because they "didn't know" that the cigarettes they've been smoking for 10 years would give them cancer even though it says that on the box there should be laws that protect those stupid idiots from their own stupidity.

And besides those that are stupid, there's those that just don't care. Yeah you don't need a law to say that a kid might be taken care of by his parents, its only common sense, but how many deadbeat or abusive parents are there, WITH the law? How many more would there be if there was no consequence to them just leaving the kid?

What about people killing each other? It's common sense that it's wrong, but it still happens. Now how many MORE murders would happen if the state didn't have that law and people who were scared to do it because of the possibility of being caught and prosecuted dind't have ANYTHING to hold them back?

The world doesn't function on common sense. It functions on the "if you do something wrong ill smash your face in" principle. Its not perfect, but its the best weve got so far.

Hell Id go for that no smoking around kids ANYWHERE law, too. Whats wrong with that? Dont you want to protect children from cancer? Of is the convinience of lighting up sitting in front of your TV more important to you than the health of your kid?

quote:

Originally posted by Kytracid I wouldn't smoke with the windows up if my kids were in the backseat. The same way i wouldn't blow smoke in my kids face if we were sitting next to each other on the couch. I don't need a law to tell me these things.

thats great that you wouldn't. many people would agree with u. however not everyone. my brother-in-law smokes in the car with my 5 nieces and nephews with him. They're all under the age of 6, and have yet to understand how bad that is for them. Unfortunately my sister has the attitude "man head of household" and won't tell him to butt out. i've tried, but like he listens to me. According to this genius, its all ok, cuz the windows are opened a crack

maybe a law like this will teach my oh so intelligentbrother-in-law that he doesn't have a choice and to stop smoking in the car.

Someone has to speak on reuben, logan, alayna, sam and norahs behalf. if he won't listen to me, maybe he listen to the cops