quote:

Originally posted by kamil "Technically" none. But does it matter?

People have been conquered and subdued for thousands of years. The Europeans conquered the entire world! The British gave opium to the Chinese to keep them subdued. The French, Germans, Dutch, Spanish and Portugese colonized areas for profit and enslaved the native population. Slavery existed in the United States until it was abolished after the Civil War. The "White Man's Burden" was to civilize the world from the peoples of Africa to the Indians of North and South America. We have done something we thought just at the time and hindsight shows us otherwise. Since innocent people died in World War II, using your logic, it was wrong to defeat Hitler while he was killing millions?

Calling the the US evil is wrong before you look at yourself.

quote:

Originally posted by habsfan Are you even in university??? Look at the source you just gave me, Washington Post....yeah that's not biased. Oh and here's the best part: "Of a dozen service members interviewed, only one said he voted against Mr. Bush, and he asked that his name not be published. "

Actually its Washington Times. Get it right.

I picked that article from a nice archive from Military.com website. The actual website of our Troops. It was in the news archive, if they didn't believe it was true Im sure they would of not put it in their archive.

http://www.military.com/News/Home/


another one

quote:

Military personnel back Bush, poll finds BY CHARLES HOMANS Washington Bureau WASHINGTON — Despite Sen. John Kerry's attempts to woo the military vote, active-duty military personnel and their families remain solidly behind President Bush, according to a survey released Friday. Pollsters are legally barred from directly asking military personnel whom they plan to vote for. But when asked which candidate they would trust more as their commander in chief, survey participants chose Bush over Kerry by a greater than 2-to-1 ratio. Among the 655 active-duty personnel and their families polled, 69 percent said they had a favorable opinion of Bush while 29 percent said they felt the same way about Kerry, according to the survey sponsored by the University of Pennsylvania's Annenberg Public Policy Center. "Part of it has to do with (Kerry's) anti-Vietnam protests, which are as salient for the military as his record of combat valor," said Peter Feaver, a political scientist at Duke University in Durham, N.C., who studies politics in the military. Among all Americans, Bush has a narrower advantage on trust to be commander in chief, 50-41. To some extent, the findings reflect that the military is heavily Republican. Four in 10 of those polled said they were Republicans, twice the number that said they were Democrats.

another one

quote:

Duke political scientist Peter Feaver reports that the military remains overwhelmingly Republican: Pundits have long speculated that the Democrats were making strong inroads with a constituency hitherto notoriously resistant to their appeal: the military. Since Gen. Wesley Clark threw his hat in the presidential ring, reporters have chased the "military vote" story, each new media report sprinkled with anecdotes about troops who questioned the Iraq war or who drew trenchant comparisons between the Vietnam combat valor of John Kerry and President Bush. Surely Bush is in trouble, and, in a close election, perhaps the military vote might swing the outcome as it did in Florida 2000, only this time for the Democrats. Even Kerry joined the bandwagon in the first presidential debate, citing individual military supporters he met on the campaign trail (the only voters Kerry mentioned that night). We now have fairly compelling evidence, in the form of a Military Times survey of its readership (primarily career military officers and enlisted personnel), that reports of the demise of Bush's popularity were premature. By an astonishing 72 to 17 percent margin, the active-duty military personnel who took the survey favored Bush over Kerry (Guard and Reserve respondents favored Bush, 73 to 18 percent). Frankly, the margin greatly exceeds anything that I or any other analyst had expected. To be sure, the survey method is tilted in Bush's favor, because it underrepresented the short-termers and junior enlisted personnel who would presumably be more Democratic (and thus more pro-Kerry). But the poll cannot be dismissed on technical grounds. The military is not captured in sufficient numbers by regular polls to say anything meaningful, and it is very difficult to reach the military in a targeted political survey. The Military Times readership is more reflective of career military people who at least entertain the idea of serving the 20 years needed to earn full retirement benefits, and previous surveys have established that this group tends to be more Republican. However, survey methods cannot account for a spread of 55 points. If the groundswell for Kerry claimed in earlier news reports was happening, it would have shown up here.

I was on another board a few months back and bookmarked it for future reference what he had to say, Im sure most Military personnel would agree with:

"Okay, I was in Iraq for the first 12 months. You question our support of someone who puts us in harms way? Newsflash: We get paid to be in harms way. You don't understand how being anti-war is not supporting the troops? Imagine watching TV in Baghdad, like I did, and watching people bash your mission. It pisses you off, and you want to go beat the protestors asses. That is like saying you support Kurt Warner but you think football is an evil game. You can't have it both ways. If you support troops then you motivate them, not demoralize them with your mouth. You, sir, do not in fact support the troops no matter how much you claim to. Getting "bombed in the desert" does not demoralize combat troops like myself. Actually, the actual fighting is the biggest rush you can have and can be addicting. And, yes, sighning a contract gives the government the right to use you as they see fit. Military life is quite different than civilian life, son."

Fact of the matter is..if you havent been in the politics scene long enough to notice that the military votes Republican everytime, then I'd say its time to start seeking a different interest to look into. This isnt about bias, its about reality, the military overwhelming supports Bush and you have yet to even mention Kerry's name and have sunk to the Clinton argument which is basically bashing Bush's name without mentioning the alternative. Your bias is making you blind to reality sir.



I dare you find a poll or voter statistic that showed such overwhelming support for John Kerry from the military. Fact of the matter is you Michael Moore Liberals love to put words in peoples mouth. I suggest go find a party platform to stand on and help the democrats find a soul..they really need it. Talk to me when you crawl out of your rock in 4yrs

see ya


http://home.hamptonroads.com/stories/story.cfm?story=76946&ran=163002

quote:

Originally posted by speedracer_mec how many times have you copied and pasted that? maybe next time think of something on your own. GG kthx. Talk to me when you have crawled out of that rock in 4 yrs. BYE

Why should he write his own thoughts when someone else already did it perfectly?

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quote:

Originally posted by speedracer_mec Fact of the matter is..if you havent been in the politics scene long enough to notice that the military votes Republican everytime, then I'd say its time to start seeking a different interest to look into. This isnt about bias, its about reality, the military overwhelming supports Bush and you have yet to even mention Kerry's name and have sunk to the Clinton argument which is basically bashing Bush's name without mentioning the alternative. Your bias is making you blind to reality sir.

Yep, he's right. I know someone who works at the Pentagon, while he may not have cared for all of Bush's views, he still voted Bush because he was Ex U.S. Army, and was strongly against Kerry's views for plans with the military.

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Died Tragically Rescuing His Family From The Wreckage Of A Destroyed Sinking Battleship

quote:

Originally posted by fastmp3 [IMG][/IMG]

"Beware the leader who bangs the drum of war in order to whip the citizenry into a patriotic fervor. For patriotism is indeed a double-edged sword. It both emboldens the blood, just as it narrows the mind. And when the drums of war have reached a fever pitch and the blood boils with hate and the mind has closed, the leader will have no need in seizing the rights of the citizenry. Rather, the citizenry, infused with fear and patriotism, will offer up all of their rights to the leader and gladly so. How do I know? For this is what I have done. And I am Julius Caesar." - Julius Caesar

Another quote that pretty much means the same thing. You know, you can find "quotes" to support pretty much anything. I could give a bunch of pro-war/government quotes just as easily.

___________________
Robots, machines, mechanical beings
Automatic and synthetic, we have the means
To take control of this planet and the human race
With our electronic rhythms and the Armageddon Bass

quote:

Originally posted by kamil "Technically" none. But does it matter?

Oh....so there's a footnote then...

What would that be?
Maybe the fact the States hasn't annexing anything at all.
Just because of their involvement in helping others' affairs doesn't make them the bad guys...

That would be like someone hitting my sister but because I was there and helped defend her from the assault, I'm all of a sudden the bad guy for jumping in???
What kind of logic is that?

We live in a global village where countries are interdependent of each other and help each other out.
Taking that thought forward, if the Iraqis people REALLY didn't want the Americans/Coalition there; where are all the millions of protesting people then?
Surely that couldn't have slipped by the Liberal conflict-seeking North American media...

___________________
"...End? No, the journey doesn't end here. Death is just another path...one that we all must take.
The grey rain-curtain of this world rolls back, and all change to silver glass...and then you see it...
...white shores...and beyond...the far green country under a swift sunrise."

quote:

Originally posted by Radagast "Beware the leader who bangs the drum of war in order to whip the citizenry into a patriotic fervor. For patriotism is indeed a double-edged sword. It both emboldens the blood, just as it narrows the mind. And when the drums of war have reached a fever pitch and the blood boils with hate and the mind has closed, the leader will have no need in seizing the rights of the citizenry. Rather, the citizenry, infused with fear and patriotism, will offer up all of their rights to the leader and gladly so. How do I know? For this is what I have done. And I am Julius Caesar." - Julius Caesar

Thats fake, Caesar never said that.

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quote:

Originally posted by speedracer_mec -P.S. I deal with plenty of liberals on this forum....We argue, discuss, etc...which is fine. At the end of the day we get along. I post garbage when neccessary and post arguments when needed......YOU however are the most pathetic loser on this forum. I had not seen you on this board during the entire campaign. what constitutes you as such? 1. Your lame posts? 2. The length of your posts? 3. Hateful, Rude, Disgusting Language? 4. Your brain Combine them 4 and you have a senseless trash. END

Dude, don't you think this is the case of the pot calling the kettle black? It seems you devote your life to this political forum and sit behind a computer getting emailed responses to threads just to make sure you can put in your semi-intelligent 2cent comments.
I think the term 'pathetic loser' suits you a hell of alot more than anyone else on this board. Live a little

quote:

Originally posted by Fir3start3r if the Iraqis people REALLY didn't want the Americans/Coalition there; where are all the millions of protesting people then? Surely that couldn't have slipped by the Liberal conflict-seeking North American media...

Where was the American/Coalition after the gulf war? Who let Saddam back in power? Who let Iraq's people suffer because it was not in their best interest to intervene.
Did you see the millions of people protesting after America pulled its troops out? Giving the people a sense of hope? Provoking them to stand up against Saddaam... which they did. And then what? They left.
What do you think happened to those who stood up to Saddaam after the troops of the gulf war bailed?

quote:

Originally posted by Reverend_Trance People have been conquered and subdued for thousands of years. The Europeans conquered the entire world! The British gave opium to the Chinese to keep them subdued. The French, Germans, Dutch, Spanish and Portugese colonized areas for profit and enslaved the native population. Slavery existed in the United States until it was abolished after the Civil War. The "White Man's Burden" was to civilize the world from the peoples of Africa to the Indians of North and South America. We have done something we thought just at the time and hindsight shows us otherwise. Since innocent people died in World War II, using your logic, it was wrong to defeat Hitler while he was killing millions? Calling the the US evil is wrong before you look at yourself.

I agree

Yeah really you're saying that everyone except the United States is and has always been an agel, come on

Throughout history every country has only acted in it's own interests and everyone has been an ass...and by everyone I mean everyone...

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