So what exactly are you proposing?

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Originally posted by George Smiley So what exactly are you proposing?

The Total Withdraw of all forces from Iraq.
and I say that with a heavy heart cause right now, the way things are. Its damned if we do, damned if we don't. and people will die

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Originally posted by LazFX The Total Withdraw of all forces from Iraq. and I say that with a heavy heart cause right now, the way things are. Its damned if we do, damned if we don't. and people will die

True.

No insurgency has won though without outside help. That would be Iran/Syria.

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Originally posted by Krypton True. No insurgency has won though without outside help. That would be Iran/Syria.

Yea we should go to war with them next shouldn't we?

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Originally posted by Krypton True. No insurgency has won though without outside help. That would be Iran/Syria.

True, but Iran is not going to last long in its present form... the people and the youth are tired of AMIANASSORWHATamed rule. People in developed nations are starting to see through all the BS that they have been fed. Syria is a mystery to me. But Iran, the people are hard working and honorable. They will not take AMIANASSORWHATamed shit much longer.

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Originally posted by LazFX True, but Iran is not going to last long in its present form... the people and the youth are tired of AMIANASSORWHATamed rule. People in developed nations are starting to see through all the BS that they have been fed. Syria is a mystery to me. But Iran, the people are hard working and honorable. They will not take AMIANASSORWHATamed shit much longer.

What's that based on?

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Originally posted by George Smiley What's that based on?

Uhhh, the Iranian Reformist Movement? Duh...

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Yea we should go to war with them next shouldn't we?

If the US wants to defeat this insurgency, they have to cut off the outside help. How they do it, thru' diplomacy, 'soft revolution', or war is up to the politicians. If the US 'cuts n runs', then it really doesn't matter then, send them home now. Let Iran have all the fun they want with Iraq.

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Originally posted by Krypton Uhhh, the Iranian Reformist Movement? Duh...

You mean that you know there is a reformist movement, or you know that it enjoys the support of the majority of the population?

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If the US wants to defeat this insurgency, they have to cut off the outside help. How they do it, thru' diplomacy, 'soft revolution', or war is up to the politicians. If the US 'cuts n runs', then it really doesn't matter then, send them home now. Let Iran have all the fun they want with Iraq.

But are the Sunnis not doing as much damage as the Shia? More to the point, why has everybody forgotten that the Sunnis, not the Shia, are supposed to be the enemy in this "war on terror"? You also make the false and dangerous assumption that the insurgency is a) unified, b) made up of foreign nationals and c) entirely foreign funded. It is an insurgency where maybe 10% militants are foreign and the rest are Iraqi. They are not unified either, they all form small groups depending on religion or politics.

By categorising the insurgency as one harmoneous group funded and supported by one source, you make a very ignorant but more importantly dangerous observation that if adhered to by our policy makers will prove disasterous for Iraq (and is doing so)

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Originally posted by George Smiley You mean that you know there is a reformist movement, or you know that it enjoys the support of the majority of the population? But are the Sunnis not doing as much damage as the Shia? More to the point, why has everybody forgotten that the Sunnis, not the Shia, are supposed to be the enemy in this "war on terror"? You also make the false and dangerous assumption that the insurgency is a) unified, b) made up of foreign nationals and c) entirely foreign funded. It is an insurgency where maybe 10% militants are foreign and the rest are Iraqi. They are not unified either, they all form small groups depending on religion or politics. By categorising the insurgency as one harmoneous group funded and supported by one source, you make a very ignorant but more importantly dangerous observation that if adhered to by our policy makers will prove disasterous for Iraq (and is doing so)

Really don't know what you mean by 'forgotten' the Sunnis...

I made no a, b, c assumptions, you did, then said I made them. I know it's not unified, etc. But the reason they are so strong is solely because of outside help. Do you actually believe the Iraqi people support the terrorism? Hell no, otherwise, they'de be in a peace by now. I am not saying the help comes from one source, but the main culprits are Iran/Syria, and we have yet to negociate or deal with them in any constructive way.

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Originally posted by Krypton The enemy just puts a bullet in your head after excruciating torture. The coalition does not execute prisoners en masse or systematically torture them. Are we finding detainees floating in the rivers with bullet holes in the back of their heads? NO. I'm not condoning any illegal acts, but our enemy is much much worse. At least we prosecute our violations.

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Originally posted by Krypton Uhhh, the Iranian Reformist Movement? Duh...If the US wants to defeat this insurgency, they have to cut off the outside help. How they do it, thru' diplomacy, 'soft revolution', or war is up to the politicians. If the US 'cuts n runs', then it really doesn't matter then, send them home now. Let Iran have all the fun they want with Iraq.

That enemy is supported by yours.
Great difference between the Iraqi resistance &........

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Originally posted by LazFX True, but Iran is not going to last long in its present form... the people and the youth are tired of AMIANASSORWHATamed rule. People in developed nations are starting to see through all the BS that they have been fed. Syria is a mystery to me. But Iran, the people are hard working and honorable. They will not take AMIANASSORWHATamed shit much longer.

i've told u before
no media lies

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"Politics is too serious a matter to be left to the politicians."



Charles de Gaulle

"Ohhh DRAMA!!!" lol you guys realise that the Geneva convention IS being observed.... it's just the HRA.... the same thing that has for example lead to claims against the goverment about prisoners not getting to vote and about a million other pretty much BS requests.

The convention if far more applicable here (basicly = no torture). To apply the HRA would be basicly crazy given the situation.

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If you can read this, I'm seriously fucking bored.