such a good topic. i have been thinking the same.

i think its because there are a growing number of kids downloading a copy of cubase and being shown the basics by a friend. they have been deejaying for a few months and realise that everyone is making music and feel left out. the problem is, most are not musically minded. its like they just get this urge to make a trance track but dont have enough background knowledge on what makes a good tune. some even get the production bug bad, and work and work on something that they dont even feel that deeply about, but get the production sounding near professional. i am noticing some amazing mixing qualities on very new producer's tracks, but the tunes usually lack any artistic emotion.

so many new ta members with the right mindset, just without the ideas and creativity(due to a lack of experience in their chosen genre). personally i enjoy every track i make- i make them for me mainly. and i only take on board technical issues like mixing level problems when i get negative crit. the rest of the track is my own artistic style which wont be mine if i go against what i was going for originally.

the best (imo) advise for people unsure where to go with tracks is to listen to more music or look for other sources of inspiration so they have a better understanding on what they are trying to acheive.

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It's really hard to be truly original though. If you put jazz influences in trance tracks, they might colide. Maybe you want to make an uplifiting trance track with indian influences so you want to put a sarangi in your track. It sounds awkward and incoherant.

in other words, you have to be a genius to even make original music.

edit:

I'm pretty sure some of you have tried to do some crazy things in your tracks, to only find out that they don't work. We live in an age where we can hear music at a press of a button. We live in an age where information on making music is available instantly.

Music isn't confined to a few people like it was back in the day. Today you can go on the net, or go buy a book to learn how to play an instrument or learn a sequencer.

It's hard to find original music because of that. What's done is being done.

quote:

Originally posted by richg101 the best (imo) advise for people unsure where to go with tracks is to listen to more music or look for other sources of inspiration so they have a better understanding on what they are trying to acheive.

Which is why I'm saving up for some DJ stuff. Thought it'd be a nice way to pay attention to the genres and maintain some artistic freedom.

For me being artistic is to know how to use your production techniques to deliver the artistic ideas in your head.

Excellent Producer without artistic vision = Studio Engineer.
Excellent Artist with no good techniques = producer who needs an Engineer.

then both are important !

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Haha I think I'm notorious for those 2 min clip & runs... but like Numbers said, it's a great way to get opinions if you're heading in the right direction or not.

quote:

Originally posted by Mr.Mystery Just some things I've been thinking about for quite a while now. How strong of a vision do you have about the tracks you're working on? How much feedback are you willing to take into consideration from other people? I'm just wondering because I keep seeing these threads where people post 2 minute clips into the promotion forum and then ask people what they should be doing next... and I just don't get it. It seems like people obsess too much over production quality and the artistic vision is completely forgotten. In my opinion the vision should be the strongest part of a producer/composer, I'd much rather have an amazing track with adequate production than the other way around. Ah well, maybe I'm just rambling... any thoughts?

If you forget that it's all about the music, then you've lost your way. Production quality is important, everyone should learn the basics of EQing and so forth, but beyond that you shouldn't obsess over it. I think it's good for beginners to get feedback from someone, even if from the promotion forum. Once your tracks progress beyond the newb stage, you shouldn't really care what anyone thinks of your particular artistic vision. If what you are doing sounds good to you, and moves you, you've done well.

I put composition and artistic vision first, production second. It's possible the production quality suffers a tad here and there, because I don't feel like getting a sound engineering degree. :P I'm hoping my music is interesting enough, and moving enough, that it overrides any less than perfect production.

I think it's a good idea for artistic people to find a partner who is skilled at sound engineering, or even hire someone to mix and master their tracks. That way the artist can concentrate soley on the music and artistic vision. That would be my ideal situation, maybe one day I'll work up to that.

quote:

Originally posted by Internet TufGai in the end though you're going to need both. How exactly are you going to express what you want if your bass and kick don't mesh well? What if you suck at programming your synths?

You could just hire a producer like... some people

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quote:

Originally posted by Mr.Mystery Just some things I've been thinking about for quite a while now. How strong of a vision do you have about the tracks you're working on? How much feedback are you willing to take into consideration from other people? I'm just wondering because I keep seeing these threads where people post 2 minute clips into the promotion forum and then ask people what they should be doing next... and I just don't get it. It seems like people obsess too much over production quality and the artistic vision is completely forgotten. In my opinion the vision should be the strongest part of a producer/composer, I'd much rather have an amazing track with adequate production than the other way around. Ah well, maybe I'm just rambling... any thoughts?

So would I and that's one of the reasons why so many productions have become bland and stereotypical. People are way too focused on production quality rather than the actual composition.

That's the one thing I loved about the tracks from 7-8 years ago. Their production quality can be pretty poor, there is a distinct lack of atmosphere and fills yet somehow, they are just magical. The synths are unpolished, the EQ isn't complete, the mastering may be bad but...the music! The melody! It's hypnotic. It drives the track. You forget about the quality and get stuck on the lead.

As for feedback from others, I take more technical feedback into consideration rather than the compositional. I think the artist should stick to their vision mostly and not make major changes.

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I fuck around and don't listen to anyones oppinion or advice, unless they're telling me it's awesome.

I have a sign in my studio which says "Beautiful Music First. THEN Incredible Production" to remind myself what the main purpose is.

But both aspects are absolutely vital. Trance to me is about beautiful melodies, absolutely, but it's also about amazing sound design and cutting edge production quality. It's integral to the whole feel of the style. Even the old tracks which may sound dated now, they were at the forefront of trance production back in the day. If the producers made those tracks again today, the production quality would be raised. There were many great tracks 5, 10 years ago, there are many great tracks coming out today.

Sure, there are a bunch of soul-less tracks around, old and new. And more so on websites like this where people are still developing their musical/ artistic vision. It takes many artists a long time to hone their skills to the point where they can realise their vision, or for that vision to become clear. It's incorrect to think "you're either born with it or you aren't". Anyone could create the greatest music on Earth, given enough love and dedication. Anyone.

In terms of listening to feedback - it totally depends on the person it's coming from. Obviously, they need to have a degree of familiarity with the style. And, they need to be coming from a place of love for the music. I see a lot of feedback which is just plain destructive. That means the person providing it has no love for the music. Feedback is really helpful if the critiquer suggests what they would do, production-wise. If it's just "the bassline sounds bad", well, there's not much to learn from that, apart from "find other people to provide feedback to me"!

quote:

Originally posted by richg101 such a good topic. i have been thinking the same. i think its because there are a growing number of kids downloading a copy of cubase and being shown the basics by a friend. they have been deejaying for a few months and realise that everyone is making music and feel left out. the problem is, most are not musically minded. its like they just get this urge to make a trance track but dont have enough background knowledge on what makes a good tune. some even get the production bug bad, and work and work on something that they dont even feel that deeply about, but get the production sounding near professional. i am noticing some amazing mixing qualities on very new producer's tracks, but the tunes usually lack any artistic emotion. so many new ta members with the right mindset, just without the ideas and creativity(due to a lack of experience in their chosen genre). personally i enjoy every track i make- i make them for me mainly. and i only take on board technical issues like mixing level problems when i get negative crit. the rest of the track is my own artistic style which wont be mine if i go against what i was going for originally. the best (imo) advise for people unsure where to go with tracks is to listen to more music or look for other sources of inspiration so they have a better understanding on what they are trying to acheive.

Well said.

I always strive for the artistic side to come out but lately its been more about quality for me and as a result the time its taking me to make a track has increased somewhat. As each track goes by, I ask myself can I improve and make this one better than the last? If I can, I feel I'm progressing. I've always made the tracks for me but lately after 4 years now of producing, there is that urge that you want your efforts to be heard by others so the focus on quality starts taking precidence. For me its like I want to know, do I have what it takes? Kind of like a personal assurance that I can do this because in the beginning, I always was scared of music production and thought I couldn't be smart enough to figure it out.

I also totally agree with the idea that so many DJs just get into music production because they are sick of spinning amongst 1000 other bedroom DJs and they want to stand out somehow. However many have 0 musical background and end up getting frustrated or end up wasting their time in vain. Thankfully in my case, my parents forced me to play an instrument at the age of 8 and I believe that has really helped me along. Music is my passion and I don't see myself ever stopping, even if that means that nobody but myself and my circle of friends hears what I make. That may be hard for me to swallow if that is all that ever happens, but getting it out of me is what makes it worth it.

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Actually i have never changed something in a track based on comments i have gotten when posting on the forum.

I am just aware of the comments and critics of my previous track and try to get better at those points on the next track.

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