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TranceAddict Forums > Other > Political Discussion / Debate > "The Rise of The Rest"
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atbell
Supreme tranceaddict



Registered: May 2007
Location: Toronto, Canada

quote:
Originally posted by Krypton
Let's have a look at decline in past empires...namely the Roman Empire...



wikipedia


It's interesting that this description of the Roman decline doesn't mention Appian, a Roman historian. His work offeres one of the best accounts of the full Roman history.

The collection that I read recently is called "The Civil Wars" and is a collection of four of his books that cronicle a 200 year period around 0 AD or so. This is the time of Julius Ceasar, Mark Antony, and Octavian (Ceasar's son).

It's a great account of how the conflicts start and perpetuate. It's also striking how many of the issues are similar to what is going on today. Land tax reforms, land seisures, government control, the division of spoils of war, and multi-generational bi-partizan fighting were some of the most notable causes of conflict as recorded by Appian.

Old Post May-14-2008 01:43  Canada
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jerZ07002
Supreme tranceaddict



Registered: Dec 2006
Location:

quote:
Originally posted by atbell
Nah, American dollars and know how are only part of what's bringing these countries to the fore.

They have each used thier own ideas, cultures, and beleifs to temper and addapt US failings. China has been particularily good at takeing a slow and cautious aproach to growth while advancing toward greater freedom. Studying thier foreign and domestic policy it is clear that the leadership has spent many years going over the problems Russia had after the fall of the wall and the problems the US has had with global resentment. The things they (the Chinese comunist party) learned are evident in thier control of the curency value, the slow privatization (to minimize the looting that happened in Russia), and the non-interventionist policy (which they clearly learned from US administrative hypocracy in foreign policy).

The internal factors that have contributed to thier growth are mostly present in thier regection of blindly accepting conversion to US based political and economic systems.

What we can expect in the future is to find out which new system works best. It's all evolution. The BRIC countries (that's the G+S term) are going to be building on the foundation that the US provided, which was built on the Western European foundation, which was built on the Roman, Greek, and Ottoman foundations, etc. etc.

I'm actually really excited to see where the new collision of ideas will go, especially in the theological / philosophical / political relms.


on a percentage scale how much credit does america deserve for the extraordinary growth of these countries in the past few years? For china and india i would say its very high. With China in particular i would venture to say that US consumerism and direct foreign investment by US multinational (by way of joint ventures) has been the driving factor. I say China in particular because the foreign companies could not set up an operate in china without forming joint ventures with chinese firms. the joint ventures allowed chinese firms to copy our industrial practices and learn how to operate succesfully. It also prevented our firms from entering and dominating their market.

today, the particular problem with china is there is very little transparency in their financial markets. we are taking for their word without the regulatory structure we have here and in western europe. Even with our accounting standards fortune 500 companies still get over on western investors; could you imagine the accounting practices in china? the chinese banking system is going to run in to some serious bumps when investors finally demand transparency. as of now, investors have been content in receiving the tremendous growth without asking questions. that will end soon.

Old Post May-14-2008 03:55  United States
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Stasis
41º 42' N, 86º 10' W



Registered: Feb 2003
Location: New England

Fareed has it right. We've been looking at things the wrong way--power isn't necessarily shifting to a new center (like China or India), it's simply becoming decentralized. It's World 2.0.


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Old Post May-15-2008 13:40  United States
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Lira
Ancient BassAddict



Registered: Nov 2001
Location: Brasilia, Brazil

quote:
Originally posted by Stasis
Fareed has it right. We've been looking at things the wrong way--power isn't necessarily shifting to a new center (like China or India), it's simply becoming decentralized. It's World 2.0.

Hehehe, although that's how I think the world has been for most of its history (and, it would be funny to say the second version appeard after hundreds of millenia), I totally love your analogy <3


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Old Post May-15-2008 17:14  Brazil
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