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Originally posted by Krypton How am I confused? Like most Americans, I supported the conservative agenda, until the conservative agenda went haywire the past 7 years. Don't blame me for changing parties, blame the president. The losses of staunchly conservative precincts in Mississippi and other states detail at how the Republican Party is in decline. With that decline goes myself to the other side. Yes, I hate taxes. But when the only low-tax party is so staunchly for the wrong foreign policy and continues blundering our country into destruction, I have no choice but to vote for the other party.

you vote Democrat, you've been suckered as a "conservative" IMO, but to each his own. never before since Reagan have the ideals of freedom and democracy been so implemented and encouraged.

you have a problem with spending? fine. so do most conservatives, doesn't mean that we can't ever find our way again. this is not your war? i don't have anything much more i can say to you that hasn't been said already.

what it basically comes down for you, i guess, is youre just upset and the other party is telling you everything you want to hear to make it all better. good luck.

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I'm libertarian socialist, and I'm not confused about that...

the defense rests, your honor.

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Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN well duh. doesn't change the fact that the current leaders of the republican party exude dishonesty and are the worst government that the US, UK or australia have had during my lifetime.

still waiting on the "frog marches". hell, a simple Grand Jury indictment would suffice.

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Originally posted by Shakka The fuck is that? Those two concepts can't coexist under the same mind. You might be schizophrenic!

Yea, libertarian socialist. I'm all for free markets, but when it comes down to things such as education, health care, and defense, I'm a socialist. Look at how privatized the Iraq occupation is. These companies profit from war. That is wrong, and so I would nationalize things such as logistics for the military.

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you vote Democrat, you've been suckered as a "conservative" IMO, but to each his own. never before since Reagan have the ideals of freedom and democracy been so implemented and encouraged. you have a problem with spending? fine. so do most conservatives, doesn't mean that we can't ever find our way again. this is not your war? i don't have anything much more i can say to you that hasn't been said already. what it basically comes down for you, i guess, is youre just upset and the other party is telling you everything you want to hear to make it all better. good luck.

I've never voted Democrat... until this year...

Most conservatives don't want to pull out of Iraq. What is that...like over $600 billion? My ass the likes of John McCain wants to cut spending...The other party pledges to withdraw from Iraq. The Republicans want to continue the endless destruction of the Iraqi people. Who do you think I'm going to vote for? The party of imperialism? No, I don't vote because some party tells me what I want to hear, I vote because the other party happens to advocate the right thing...

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Originally posted by Krypton Yea, libertarian socialist. I'm all for free markets, but when it comes down to things such as education, health care, and defense, I'm a socialist. Look at how privatized the Iraq occupation is. These companies profit from war. That is wrong, and so I would nationalize things such as logistics for the military.

Correct me if I'm wrong here, but libertarians are some of the biggest champions of individualism whereas socialism is generally all about the collective and the "common good". I'm thinking you might be struggling with a deeper philosophical dilemma--how to pursue wealth selfishly while still appearing like you give a shit about your fellow man. You can certainly do that, but you don't need to rationalize it under the veil of socialism...or any ism for that matter. Perhaps the label you seek is "liberaltarian?"

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"Isms in my opinion are not good. A person should not believe in an ism - he should believe in himself. I quote John Lennon: "I don't believe in Beatles - I just believe in me". A good point there. Of course, he was the Walrus. I could be the Walrus - I'd still have to bum rides off of people."

Last edited by Shakka on May-18-2008 at 01:16

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Originally posted by Shakka Correct me if I'm wrong here, but libertarians are some of the biggest champions of individualism whereas socialism is generally all about the collective and the "common good". I'm thinking you might be struggling with a deeper philosophical dilemma--how to pursue wealth selfishly while still appearing like you give a shit about your fellow man. You can certainly do that, but you don't need to rationalize it under the veil of socialism...or any ism for that matter. Perhaps the label you seek is "liberaltarian?"

You probably best understand. Libertarian socialism is a real ideology...



I don't think pure laissez-faire capitalism or pure communist socialism is good for anybody. A mixed system seems to me to be the best method of government. In my vision of a well run country, markets are free to the extent at which public health and safety are at risk. So I would strictly control the health sector. At the same time, I would find a way to completely eliminate all taxes except for a national sales tax.

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Originally posted by Q5echo all politicians are capable of breaking the law. including the pure-as-the-driven-snow Democrats. as individuals, they act individually. as for the ideals and core values that constitute either and all political parties as a whole, you can't begin to prove that conservative ideals lead to the breaking of laws. the argument that attorneys can bring substantial,or more importantly, beneficially substantial change to a Constitutional Republic is almost an oxymoron.

The effects of a more closeminded, absolute fanaticism about the way one leads one life, lending itself to the generic Catholic valuation of purity through self masochism?

You're seeing it in action; seen it in action for years now.

Conduct life more wisely than those before you.

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Originally posted by Q5echo ur so frikken confused politically, i wouldn't be shocked if you just came out on this board one day.

Yeah. What's up with people intellectually exploring the facets of the world they inhabit in order to make more informed decisions?

They should just blindly believe the bullshit of one side or the other, then insult others who attempt to input anything into our crystal meth hardened heads.

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Originally posted by DJ Shibby The effects of a more closeminded, absolute fanaticism about the way one leads one life, lending itself to the generic Catholic valuation of purity through self masochism?

if thats how you see it...

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Conduct life more wisely than those before you.

do you really, honestly...seriously believe you are in ANY position to tell me, or anybody for that matter, how to conduct my life?

the fact you typed that with a straight face says volumes about you.

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Originally posted by DJ Shibby Yeah. What's up with people intellectually exploring the facets of the world they inhabit in order to make more informed decisions? They should just blindly believe the bullshit of one side or the other, then insult others who attempt to input anything into our crystal meth hardened heads.

this is Krypton we're talking about.

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Originally posted by Q5echo this is Krypton we're talking about.

At least I have the intellectual honestly to realize when I'm wrong and to change my views accordingly. Ideologues never change their views, no matter how cracked up they may be...

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Originally posted by Krypton At least I have the intellectual honestly to realize when I'm wrong and to change my views accordingly. Ideologues never change their views, no matter how cracked up they may be...

alright. i'm sorry.

i'll try and conduct myself in this thread accordingly.