Just because a song doesn't have a kick doesn't mean you can't determine the tempo of it. It really does take a lot of practice but after a while you should be able to get it down. If there are hi-hats or something repetitive going on in the track then use them. Otherwise, good luck and have fun. You can do it!

quote:

Originally posted by david.michael Just to be Devil's Advocate.... http://www.youtube.com/v/cqP0WNpojFM&hl http://www.youtube.com/v/dQHjGGQgVcA&hl http://www.youtube.com/v/k-rqOJDo0-8&hl http://www.youtube.com/v/80fE63zIgyg&hl

I just picked one of those at random and it had a clearly defined time signature. So yea I'm going to assume that all of those songs do indeed have a beat.

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Was it the last one? I was most "iffy" about it.

It was the first one. A Radiohead song, the time signature is 4/4 and the tempo is approximately 105 beats per minute. I haven't looked at any of the rest.

___________________
I've never been able to eat a whole baby.
Kill the women. Eat the children.
It's just one of those days where you want to bend over everyone you know and kiss their ass goodbye with a big sideways boot.

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Upon second listen....It sounds like they snap it to 4/4 eventually. But initially, I don't think it has a definable time signature. If it is, it's not 4/4. Try to tap it or set a metronome to it.

Though, that could just be defined as "playing expressively" I suppose.

Last edited by david.michael on May-23-2008 at 20:32

The drums just come in it doesn't change. To prove this to myself I walked over to my drumset and started jamming in 4/4 time at approximately 105 beats per minute to the instrumental part.

___________________
I've never been able to eat a whole baby.
Kill the women. Eat the children.
It's just one of those days where you want to bend over everyone you know and kiss their ass goodbye with a big sideways boot.

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Something really seems like it changes between the (beginning of the) intro and when the drums are playing. Maybe it's just tempo variations. I can hear it in time signature now, but it doesn't seem to be 4/4 to me. Meh, oh well.

Scratch that, I can sense a time signature throughout now. But I just can't wrap my head around that it's 4/4 in this example.

Triple post

Interestingly enough, there is some debate to the time signature of this piece.

It seems to be in 16/8, which seems to be more along the lines of what I was thinking... however...

quote:

the 16/8 meter does not account for (a) the phrasing of the song's lyrics, (b) the stress pattern of drums, bass, and other instruments, and (c) the piano's chord changes (especially in the F#min -- E9 section). A pattern of 6/8, 10/8, 10/8, 6/8 appears to account for those additional features. Here is an attempt to display the relationship between chords, bars, and lyrics:

Neat.

either do it traditionally but use the melody, pads, or bassline to listen for the tempo, or you gotta figure out the bpm of the two tracks beforehand and cross your fingers that you dropped them at the right time.

if you would like, check out the mix in my sig, i mix in a "beatless" intro track from a 125ish bpm tech house number by mixing into/out of a breakdown in both tracks. they also were in the same key which made the transition sound a whole lot smoother.

quote:

Originally posted by david.michael Triple post Interestingly enough, there is some debate to the time signature of this piece. It seems to be in 16/8, which seems to be more along the lines of what I was thinking... however... Neat.

Cool. My main point really is that all music has a beat whether or not we know the time signature or can figure out the tempo there really is not any such thing as "beatless" music.

I was just watching that last piece you posted and it is fairly nuts. I am quite sure it has a few changes in signature and tempo, but I would not be able to tell you what they are without picking up the sheet music and looking at it.

That quote you posted though explains how I thought it was 4/4 and you thought it was something else. If it goes 6/8 10/8 10/8 6/8 and then repeats that is basically a group of 32 eighth notes repeating. That is analogous to 16 quarter notes repeating which is would be 4 bars of 4/4 time at 105 BPM, however the 'feel' is a bit different since the eighth notes are getting the beat here instead of the quarter notes.

___________________
I've never been able to eat a whole baby.
Kill the women. Eat the children.
It's just one of those days where you want to bend over everyone you know and kiss their ass goodbye with a big sideways boot.

Latest Mix

Last edited by Zild on May-24-2008 at 13:26

quote:

Originally posted by Zild Cool. My main point really is that all music has a beat whether or not we know the time signature or can figure out the tempo there really is not any such thing as "beatless" music. I was just watching that last piece you posted and it is fairly nuts. I am quite sure it has a few changes in signature and tempo, but I would not be able to tell you what they are without picking up the sheet music and looking at it. That quote you posted though explains how I thought it was 4/4 and you thought it was something else. If it goes 6/8 10/8 10/8 6/8 and then repeats that is basically a group of 32 eighth notes repeating. That is analogous to 16 quarter notes repeating which is would be 4 bars of 4/4 time at 105 BPM, however the 'feel' is a bit different since the eighth notes are getting the beat here instead of the quarter notes.

Excellent point!

I do think that "beatless music" does exist though, whether or not these are true examples of it. Or, at least, music written in "free time".