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Originally posted by chico they are just restricting it, despite being legal it is potentially harmful and they want to keep it out of view from kids going into stores which is just an extension of banning advertising of smoking products.

Why cant we think of the children while treating adults like children??!?! LOL!

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they have done it with alcohol which is restricted to LCBOs unlike many other countries where you would see it openly in the supermarket.

Actually you can buy liquor and beer in supermarkets in parts of Canada. It's Ontario that acts like the nanny. And if you think the LCBO is about safety and health you are dead wrong. It's all about being a monopoly and HUGE government revenues. Smokes and liquour are freely available in most of the world and they seem to function as good if not better than we do!

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you also wouldn't see guns in a glass cabinet at the corner store when you pick up your paper.

So you are comparing booze and smokes to guns? hahahah now thats funny!

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all these things have age limits so i would interpret it as preventing encouragement of young people before they are old enough to make educated and mature decisions.

But now we are restricting adults. Kids cannot buy booze and smokes. And now adults arent even allowed to make a choice. Its ridiculous to invoke the kid factor when its already illegal to sell the product to them.

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women also have age limits, but they are harder for government to monitor the distribution of.

Thats because they cant tax them!! LOL

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fatty foods don't cause specific damage to health unless mis-used over a period of time.

this is also true of smoking. You dont get cancer from one cigarette. But there is a movement afoot now to control the types of food we eat. Of course its starting with kids now but soon it will extend to everyone else just like the other bans have.

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although this is also true of alcohol, it carries other dangers on a more immediate basis due to it's intoxicating effects hence requires monitoring. whether this is true of smoking is entirely debatable.

But where does this "monitoring" stop? If you are an adult and you get really drunk and do soemthing illegal, you should be charged. But the majority of smokers, drinkers, and mcdonalds eaters are law abiding citizens. Why should they be treated like criminals?

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Originally posted by Jayx1 And then they wonder why tourism is at its lowest in 40 years? LOL!! DUH!!!

This proves it, you do smoke crack!

How about :
a) highest dollar value in 30-40 years.
b) poor U.S. economy.
c) increased security scrutiny.

Keep the message on point. If you are going to talk about smokes, talk about smokes. Smoking has nothing to do with tourism. It would be pretty ridiculous to decide where to vacation depending on their smoking laws.

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Originally posted by Orko This proves it, you do smoke crack! How about : a) highest dollar value in 30-40 years. b) poor U.S. economy. c) increased security scrutiny. Keep the message on point. If you are going to talk about smokes, talk about smokes. Smoking has nothing to do with tourism. It would be pretty ridiculous to decide where to vacation depending on their smoking laws.

Actually those things are all factors but also listed as factors were the following:

-Tourists polled do not think there is value in Toronto for the money

-Fun factor for tourists has declined (again based on tourists polled)

-No new or innovative tourist attractions

-Tourists are scared of the vast amount of homeless beggars.

What i am getting at is that laws such as smoking laws, and club crackdowns and many of the other nanny state initiatives as of late only kick a tourism dog while it's down. The last thing tourism needs right now are more ways for us to tell them how NOT to enjoy themselves. Sorry Tourism Toronto, but Peter Russel cracking a few jokes wont get tourists back.

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Originally posted by Orko This proves it, you do smoke crack! How about : a) highest dollar value in 30-40 years. b) poor U.S. economy. c) increased security scrutiny. Keep the message on point. If you are going to talk about smokes, talk about smokes. Smoking has nothing to do with tourism. It would be pretty ridiculous to decide where to vacation depending on their smoking laws.

Don't forget to add in the price of oil. It definitely is a deterrent for those within driving distance of Canada...

If we had something worth visiting, the americans would still make the trip. At $1.57 per euro they are still going to Europe because the product is worth the expense. It's time to fix our product, and nanny state laws will only hinder, not help tourism.

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So you are comparing booze and smokes to guns? hahahah now thats funny!

i am saying they are all controlled, potentially dangerous,legal products, stop me if i'm wrong.

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Actually you can buy liquor and beer in supermarkets in parts of Canada. It's Ontario that acts like the nanny. And if you think the LCBO is about safety and health you are dead wrong. It's all about being a monopoly and HUGE government revenues. Smokes and liquour are freely available in most of the world and they seem to function as good if not better than we do!

sure there are big revenues and a factor (same reason they never make smoking illegal despite further restrictions), but i wouldn't doubt for a second that part of it is about monitoring and control as you say yourself to be present in the system

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But now we are restricting adults. Kids cannot buy booze and smokes. And now adults arent even allowed to make a choice. Its ridiculous to invoke the kid factor when its already illegal to sell the product to them.

i'm not saying it's right or wrong, but that may well be part of their reasoning (or justification if you prefer) for implementation.

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But where does this "monitoring" stop? If you are an adult and you get really drunk and do soemthing illegal, you should be charged. But the majority of smokers, drinkers, and mcdonalds eaters are law abiding citizens. Why should they be treated like criminals?

all governments would love absolute control, they'll only step back when everyone can say "stop". then they try again. i don't agree with it either, just saying they want to appear to control and restrict everything, in order to absolve themselves of accountability just as much as the parents who blame the government and everyone else who passes the buck.

I understand what they say their justification is. But we all know that the more control there is, the more money they make. Sadly they hide behind safety and health and lately the environment.(the new control puppet)

Adults should be allowed to make informed choices. Im sick of the government socially engineering everyone and using their health, health care cost, safety, etc as excuses.

If i want to smoke my brains out, eat mcdonalds, have sex without a condom, not wear a seatbelt or a helmet and pass out from booze and drugs every day thats my problem.

And if it strains the public health care system, allow me to have private health care!

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Originally posted by Jayx1 Why cant we think of the children while treating adults like children??!?! LOL! Actually you can buy liquor and beer in supermarkets in parts of Canada. It's Ontario that acts like the nanny. And if you think the LCBO is about safety and health you are dead wrong. It's all about being a monopoly and HUGE government revenues. Smokes and liquour are freely available in most of the world and they seem to function as good if not better than we do! So you are comparing booze and smokes to guns? hahahah now thats funny!

And you compare a ban of smoke displays to banning everything sometime in the future. The slippery slope works both ways.

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Originally posted by Jayx1 But now we are restricting adults. Kids cannot buy booze and smokes. And now adults arent even allowed to make a choice. Its ridiculous to invoke the kid factor when its already illegal to sell the product to them. Thats because they cant tax them!! LOL

Its illegal to sell smokes to kids...but go to any high school entrance and you see hundred of kids smokings and they all are under 18+. They should have smoke cops fine all the kids smoking outside. and fine the school for not preventing this, why only the stores should be slapped on the wrist for selling to underage smokers...

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Originally posted by Jayx1 this is also true of smoking. You dont get cancer from one cigarette. But there is a movement afoot now to control the types of food we eat. Of course its starting with kids now but soon it will extend to everyone else just like the other bans have.

A fatty kid having extra candy bars will not affect people around it whereas smoking will.



You keep saying that smokes are all about taxes and revenues...yet this ban is to limit promotion, which in turn should reduce the number of people starting to smoke, thus less revenues.

This whole ban is to reduce visibility of smoking so you have less pressure on teens

IMO, i would ban cigs altogether. The gov cant do that in a day, but over time, it seems they are trying to reduce the amt of smokers ...and maybe one day the use will be almost negligible (far fetched i know!)

PS: I do not agree that stores should foot the bill for store revamps!

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Originally posted by Jayx1 And if it strains the public health care system, allow me to have private health care!

You're more than welcome to move to the US with that sort of attitude on healthcare. Come think of it, they don't have the draconian laws. You can have your ciggys and your booze in any store.

Allow ME to show you the way:

http://www.google.ca/maps?f=d&hl=en...712&ie=UTF8&z=5

___________________
If I had to move to a deserted island, I would take only one CD with me: Cygnus X - Superstring! Yes, recorded 20 times in a row!

I walked by Jayx1 on the street last week and I overheard him going on and on to some guy about oil prices and the government...

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- rabbit.joker [funny¿rabbit] | www.rabbitjoker.com |www.ddtt.org

Dark Dirty Tech Tribal. | Hands in air (trance) and feet on the floor (house).

quote:

Originally posted by rabbitjoker I walked by Jayx1 on the street last week and I overheard him going on and on to some guy about oil prices and the government...

bwahaha!

___________________
Just surrender yourself to the rhythm,
With your hands up in the sky,
Feel the energy deep inside your system
And leave this world behind...