quote:

Originally posted by skip because ears don't like the sudden change from lets say 70 to 95 dB at all (if we assume that he music in the club is 95 dB and your earplugs filter 25 dB). sudden changes is something the ears don't like and taking the plugs out will make a sudden change of 25 dB (in this case). your ears aren't used to the high level of noise and thus hearing damage will occur more easily. when you walk into the club it's not the same thing as you hear the music getting louder and louder as you walk near the dance floor where the speakers are, so your ears get better accustomed to the sound level, compared the the situation where you take the plugs of in the dance floor and the huge change comes in a second. i'm no ear doctor. this is all based on what i've read and believe to be true. i've got no scientific data to back this up (as i can't be bothered to search for it), but common sense kinda backs this up imo too as you can easily notice that sudden loud noises hurt your ears more compared to upping the volume slowly the the same level as the sudden loud noise was at.

Don't worry i'm not one of those members who demands evidence, stats and figures. Most of us are quite knowledgeable on here and i completely see where you're coming from.

You are right about everything you have said but in effect certain other activities do the same thing. Take something as simple as a Vacuum cleaner. You have ambient noise then all of a sudden your ears are listening to 70-90db of noise.

In the end of the day, of course it's not good for your ears.
But the fact that i have them in most of the time, i feel i will benefit in the long run. Even if i have the odd listen without them.

My ear plugs have the 15db filter in them. I find it perfect for extended periods of listening.

The logic is if the monitors are very loud and you can't turn them down then you need to crank your headphones which as you said is very tough on your hearing. If you have earplugs you can cut some of that volume out. Even though the monitors are blasting which forces you to crank your headphones you're still filtering out some of the volume by using the earplugs which I can only imagine helps reduce hearing damage.

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quote:

Originally posted by n3lly Don't worry i'm not one of those members who demands evidence, stats and figures. Most of us are quite knowledgeable on here and i completely see where you're coming from. You are right about everything you have said but in effect certain other activities do the same thing. Take something as simple as a Vacuum cleaner. You have ambient noise then all of a sudden your ears are listening to 70-90db of noise. In the end of the day, of course it's not good for your ears. But the fact that i have them in most of the time, i feel i will benefit in the long run. Even if i have the odd listen without them. My ear plugs have the 15db filter in them. I find it perfect for extended periods of listening.

yes. it's better to wear earplugs than not the wear them, but taking them off isn't still necessarily wise in a loud club (my ears are sensitive, so i never do it, but i do understand why someone would).

oh, and i can't the sound of a vacuum cleaner. makes me crazy. that's why i always have my headphones on if i'm vacuuming, or if someone else is.

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quote:

Originally posted by DJ RANN Good explanation, and fair enough. I understand if a DJ does, it just surprised me when I heard that clubbers were doing it. I think the most dangerous thing for your ears is not soundsystems themselves (even though they won't help) but headphones that are too loud - SPL's behave differently and are much more dangerous in enclosed spaces such as full enclosure headphones. I'm not sure about the DJing logic of getting earplugs so you can monitor form the headphones with the volume jacked right up.

The filters in the ELACIN ear plugs are designed specifically to reduce harmful frequencies. While they drop the overall sound by 9db/15/30db depending on the filter that you have. They also remove the very top end of the scale reducing the high end you hear (not completely but considerably). A small bit is also taken from the low end.

I asked the same question when i was about to purchase mine. "Wont i just turn the music up to compensate?" In the end i didn't because i was able to hear the music better. The top end was reduced with the ear plugs which meant even though i didn't feel like my ears were taking a pounding without the ear plugs they actually were.

I would usually always have some tinnitus after playing a long set but have found this isn't the case when i wear them.

I wish i could let my friends try the ear plugs so they'd get the idea but a) they don't have the same mold obviously and b)It would be very disgusting!

Hope that clears that up a little for you.


www.hearingprotection.co.uk

http://www.hearingprotection.co.uk/...d=62&Itemid=121

quote:

Originally posted by skip yes. it's better to wear earplugs than not the wear them, but taking them off isn't still necessarily wise in a loud club (my ears are sensitive, so i never do it, but i do understand why someone would). oh, and i can't the sound of a vacuum cleaner. makes me crazy. that's why i always have my headphones on if i'm vacuuming, or if someone else is.

I totally agree it's definitely not wise..
lol @ vacuum cleaner.

It makes me clean faster!!!

quote:

Originally posted by DJ RANN I think the most dangerous thing for your ears is not soundsystems themselves (even though they won't help) but headphones that are too loud - SPL's behave differently and are much more dangerous in enclosed spaces such as full enclosure headphones.

Totally agree. I'm also guilty of cranking the headphones up too loud when I'm mixing at home lol, probably another contributor. But I'm sure it's headphones at high volume that's done the damage so far (specifically DJing though - I actually keep the volume right down when listening to my iPod, which I know is how a lot of people damage their ears)

quote:

Originally posted by DJ RANN I'm not sure about the DJing logic of getting earplugs so you can monitor form the headphones with the volume jacked right up.

Well sometimes you need to jack the volume up to overcome the level of the main rig/monitors. Again, I've been told that everything becomes much clearer with the Elacin earplugs in so you can actually work quite easily with the headphones lower than you might usually use them.


Another silly thought I had which IS a bit backwards is that most speakers are clearer at higher volumes... I certainly find I can hear what's going on in my headphones and separate two tracks in the mix much better when they're quite loud (within reason, of course you don't want them distorting), much louder than normal listening volume. I have thought that maybe the Elacin earplugs will mean I can take advantage of that better dynamic range without killing my ears... but that really would be daft, I don't even turn my monitors on at home half of the time haha, so it would just be wearing earplugs to protect me from the volume of my headphones, which I could just turn down anyway!

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Back on the original subject, I phoned the manufacturers and they said it's rare for one ear canal to be that much longer than another (one of the plugs was 3-4 mm longer than the other, which is quite a lot in terms of the inner ear), so if you can feel pressure on your ear drum it's probably too long. They suggested I send it back to them and they'll trim it down.

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Stu Cox |

Speaking personally, I have the headphones at an incredibly low level with the ER15s in simply because they reduce the ambient noise and monitor noise, meaning you dont have to crank them up.

Thet are the single best purchase I have ever made, and I will not go in a club- either socially or working- without some form of hearing protection (er15s if djing/ -39SNR foamies if working sound/lights or socially where I want as much reduction as possible and clarity not as important) period.


You will also find you can hear people speaking very easily with no need to shout with them in...

Im still pestering them to make me some -50dB filters for mine, so I can use the custom ones for both Djing and other work with only a quick filter change required....no dice so far

quote:

It's like entering a mountain bike race with stabilisers on your bike, just in case you fall off.

A better analogy would be when you go mountain biking, you wear a pair of oakleys to protect your eyes from stones and shit so you dont go blind....


I dont give a shit how naff it may look to some. Im not the one with EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE in their ears for the next day and a half after 9hours of 110dB+.
Ive had tinnitus all my life (born with it) and thats enough for me cheers.

Last edited by Freak on Jul-25-2008 at 00:12

quote:

Originally posted by Stu Cox Back on the original subject, I phoned the manufacturers and they said it's rare for one ear canal to be that much longer than another (one of the plugs was 3-4 mm longer than the other, which is quite a lot in terms of the inner ear), so if you can feel pressure on your ear drum it's probably too long. They suggested I send it back to them and they'll trim it down.

PITA when you get something new that you want to test out but can't because there is a fault.

But seeing as this is the inner ear we're talking about i'd definitely take them up on that offer.

You'll be glad when they fit your perfectly as well..

Let me know how you get on with them when you get them back and how you find mixing with them.

nelly

quote:

Originally posted by DJ RANN why the hell do you need earplugs?

because i saw DT at Olympic Stade in Montreal and have permanent ear damage because of it. i have to admit when i saw people there with them in i was like thats gay, but not being able to understand people when they talk for 2 1/2 days is even gayer.

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quote:

Originally posted by Freak Speaking personally, I have the headphones at an incredibly low level with the ER15s in simply because they reduce the ambient noise and monitor noise, meaning you dont have to crank them up. Thet are the single best purchase I have ever made, and I will not go in a club- either socially or working- without some form of hearing protection (er15s if djing/ -39SNR foamies if working sound/lights or socially where I want as much reduction as possible and clarity not as important) period. You will also find you can hear people speaking very easily with no need to shout with them in... Im still pestering them to make me some -50dB filters for mine, so I can use the custom ones for both Djing and other work with only a quick filter change required....no dice so far A better analogy would be when you go mountain biking, you wear a pair of oakleys to protect your eyes from stones and shit so you dont go blind.... I dont give a shit how naff it may look to some. Im not the one with EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE in their ears for the next day and a half after 9hours of 110dB+. Ive had tinnitus all my life (born with it) and thats enough for me cheers.

I get it why someone working in the environment needs them, or someone who spends a lot of their time in a club professionally and still wants protection when they go out socially, so as to protect their ears from regular exposure to high SPLs.

But.....what I don't get are the occasional clubbers who have ear protection on the odd night out. Again, I understand maybe some people already have tinnitus (mine seems to come and go) so do the most to protect your hearing, as you already know you have a problem, but it just seems really OTT to wear them for the odd night out.

I think the thing that got me laughing was I bumped in to a group of friends in a club who all had custom earplugs in. I couldn't see it and I wouldn't have known but they couldn't hear me or each other properly until one of them said "oh just let me take this out..".

I just can't shake the thought of you are going to a club, it's going to be loud. And your head will still be ringing the next day. You know this.

As for the analogy, I kind of get your point but you don't enter a mountain bike race to look directly the sun. In the same way you don't go to a club to mainly out the wallpaper. You enter a bike race to ride as fast as you can and you go to a club (at least the first reason I do) to hear good music, knowing it will be loud. Bollox to this though - mine was a shit analogy in the first place.


Back to the subject anyway, I don't know it's probably just me but it just all seems a bit contradictory and very nancy. It's a similar issue to why Simon Cowell ended up giving back his 200 mph Aston Martin - because although it looked nice and was comfy, he could only do 11mph in london traffic. Well, going to a club with loud music only to filter it down to bedroom hifi levels is kind of the same thing and would stop me from going out in the first place.

Shite, I just did another crap analogy.