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Originally posted by RJT Really it's no different than the Pop v. Indie debate in mainstream music - but I definitely did not mean "we're bros, sort me out", sorry for the confusion.

Its alright, I didn't exactly mean it that way either.

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I don't think there's any arguing that there are a lot of "staple" labels on Beatport and that being connected to them (buddies or not) means sales for Beatport and promotion for the artist, which is obviously win-win, but I wonder as to whether or not it narrows the focus of EDM in general as well.

I just don't think that beatport's ads really have enough power to actually shift EDM in any meaningful fashion. They're just one store (albeit the biggest one, I think), but do they even have 50% of EDM single sales on the net? And of that percentage of sales, how many were decided because of an advertisement on beatport? I'll admit it is really good advertising, but still I think its relatively insignificant in the big scheme of things. Frequently, all they're doing is pointing out that they have tracks which have already been heavily promoted and will sell well no matter what, with most of the work having been done by the labels and the big name DJ's who hammer promos for several weeks in advance.

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Originally posted by Sadface They're just one store (albeit the biggest one, I think), but do they even have 50% of EDM single sales on the net?

I believe Beatport has something nearer 85% of EDM download sales. The audiojellys and trackitdowns etc share the remaining few percent.

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Listen to and download all my tracks at www.gregnicot.bandcamp.com

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Originally posted by Djeebie And as for the prices: Beatport gets 50%

not true ... the % cut is different for each label.

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djbenbrown.com

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Originally posted by RJT Nice for them I'm sure, but how nice is it from your end? Seneca's? Any label or artist? Better yet, how is it for any label or artist who isn't on Armada, m_nus, or any number of other well established and highly profitable Beatport labels?

On my end its OK. Not great but that's expected in an early stage of a career/fan base. Numbers are confidential in all cases with labels/distributors.

Anyway, yea big dogs beat out little dogs all day in ANY industry, dance music isn't immune. Most of these labels take years to develop, have an incredibly loyal fanbase, and know the industry and marketing well enough to ensure success.

Also I can't remember seeing an Armada release in top 50.. they prob do 10x as many sales on iTunes since their sound is more consumer-friendly vs. the labels that put out DJ-friendly and 'underground' dance music (beatport's forte).

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Originally posted by Sadface I just don't think that beatport's ads really have enough power to actually shift EDM in any meaningful fashion.

I do.


the big names are so few.


there are thousands of nameless deejays with residencies across the world that worship beatport

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Originally posted by Sadface I just don't think that beatport's ads really have enough power to actually shift EDM in any meaningful fashion.

You'd be surprised

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Originally posted by Ben Brown On my end its OK. Not great but that's expected in an early stage of a career/fan base. Numbers are confidential in all cases with labels/distributors.

Yeah - I didn't expect you to hook up specific numbers, was just curious. You've sold, in my mind, a lot of records this past year - obviously not like U2 or Coldplay big, but you've had a fair number of releases get a decent bit of attention, so I was just wondering if you've noticed any trends or changes as you've seen your career kind of "take off", and if your opinion of that kind of distribution has changed?

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Originally posted by Ben Brown Anyway, yea big dogs beat out little dogs all day in ANY industry, dance music isn't immune. Most of these labels take years to develop, have an incredibly loyal fanbase, and know the industry and marketing well enough to ensure success.

Absolutely agree - where I draw the line of distinction, however, is that comparatively I feel like the EDM world is at least a bit smaller, and so in general it seems to be a place where some of the "little guys" can become "big guys" relatively quickly (and more often than not be returned to "little guy" or "no guy at all" status in the course of a few years).

I like the fact that on Beatport I can really dig and find some music that appeals to me, but I guess I worry whether or not they're set up in a fashion that puts smaller artists and labels I enjoy at risk. Again, this is all stuff I know absolutely nothing about but have been very interested in, so thanks for sharing some insight.

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Originally posted by Ben Brown Also I can't remember seeing an Armada release in top 50.. they prob do 10x as many sales on iTunes since their sound is more consumer-friendly vs. the labels that put out DJ-friendly and 'underground' dance music (beatport's forte).

I was really just throwing out the two biggest labels in relatively different genres I could think of - really have no idea how well either label does on Beatport, just know that in their respective genres, each is fairly popular.

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last minute disco dot net

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Originally posted by nefardec I do. the big names are so few. there are thousands of nameless deejays with residencies across the world that worship beatport

Yeah, but it was always my understanding that these nameless dj's paid more attention to the top 100 charts and DJ top 10's, which beatport has less control over, than the ads themselves. There's certainly some correlation between amount of beatport advertising and elevated chart position, but I just can't see it being that high. Of course, with 85% of the business, even a small correlation is reasonably significant.

Either way, without looking at beatport's own statistics we'll probably never know.

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Originally posted by RJT I like the fact that on Beatport I can really dig and find some music that appeals to me, but I guess I worry whether or not they're set up in a fashion that puts smaller artists and labels I enjoy at risk. Again, this is all stuff I know absolutely nothing about but have been very interested in, so thanks for sharing some insight.

For sure. It would be in BP's best interest to facilitate growth of all dance music labels, but from a business perspective it's easier to sell dubfire than joe shmoe. It also costs a lot of money to hire people to market tracks,choose what should be featured, and all that's involved with selling, so ROI is important as well.


I'm confident that BP would be happy to see growth in the digital market from top to bottom, since they're going to be the primary distribution point (at least for now). However, I can understand that its tough to support ideals over profit when the bottom line is $ in business.

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djbenbrown.com

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Originally posted by Ben Brown For sure. It would be in BP's best interest to facilitate growth of all dance music labels, but from a business perspective it's easier to sell dubfire than joe shmoe. It also costs a lot of money to hire people to market tracks,choose what should be featured, and all that's involved with selling, so ROI is important as well.

Absolutely agree - and obviously the same can be said for pretty much any commodity. I really don't fault anyone who owns a business like Beatport, or record labels, etc. for taking the bottom line into account - anyone who would is (in my mind) denying the reality of the world. People need money to live, and idealism doesn't fill your stomach the same way a steak does.

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Originally posted by Ben Brown I'm confident that BP would be happy to see growth in the digital market from top to bottom, since they're going to be the primary distribution point (at least for now). However, I can understand that its tough to support ideals over profit when the bottom line is $ in business.

Indeed - growth in all sectors can only help them, and I guess thinking back on all this, and taking your responses into account, my worry is more over them being the primary distribution point than how they run their service.

Clearly Beatport didn't choose to be #1, but they are - and an unintended side effect of that is going to be that what is marketed most heavily by them is going to dominate the scene. Maybe I'm wrong, but I really don't think that everyone who shops there spends the time digging through all the rubbish to find the gold - so would it be wrong to think that because:

A. There's so much stuff out there these days.

B. Beatport is the primary distribution point for DD's (sorry to keep using your phrase - couldn't think of a synonym )

C. Not everyone has the time or drive to sort through it all.

...the EDM scene in general moves more and more towards a homogenized sound?

And for the record - I am not one who believes that just because there is a lot of shit out there these days, there's less good music. I really think there's electronic music put out there these days that's every bit as good as anything else that's come out over the years.

Also, this has been a great thread.

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last minute disco dot net

It's true that the Internet provides great potential to search out more really obscure, diverse stuff, but it seems like most people make very little use of that, preferring to see the net as just a way of more quickly and easily obtaining stuff they already know and stuff their friends and peers are already listening to.

In some ways dance music has been homogenizing: people across the world can now become aware of which producers, tracks, and DJs are "big" everywhere rather than mostly being buried in whatever is hot in their local scene, and this phenomenon perpetuates itself as DJs around the globe download whatever the big tracks of the month happen to be.

And in other ways it's been diversifying: I would wager that most of us have a much more diverse, eclectic, and above all international roster of tracks in our possession than we would have had if there were no Internet music.