I'm sorry - but I can't really agree with what he's saying.

Sounds to me like he's got a very large chip on his shoulder. While I respect him for what he's done, the tone of this whole interview is one of total biterness towards white's in music.

The problem with dance music is - more or less everything has been done that can be done so it's obvious that producers are going to start copying each other, it's been going on for years, but I don't think it's a problem which is soley caused by whitey.

efdemin told me in detroit that he once sampled a kenny dixon jr track and that kdj threatened him and now he stays away lol

omar s is another militant detroit guy. on one of his tracks on underground quality he goes by 'DJ Snotinburg' lol

I thought this discogs user made a great post refuting theo's comments:

quote:

In the beginning, there was jack, and jack had a groove. And from this groove came the groove of all grooves. And while one day viciously throwing down on his box, jack boldy declared, "let there be house!" And house music was born. WRONG! "I don’t think they [genre titles] actually describe any kind of music accurately, but I do know the industry uses these divisions to sell stuff and pimp people." I am, you see, I am the creator, and this is my house! And in my house there is only house music. But I am not so selfish because once you enter my house it then becomes our house and our house music! And, you see, no one man owns house because house music is a universal language, spoken and understood by all. WRONG! "This music like all other music is originated on african/black experience...this bullshit illusion that dance music has no race, no gender, that its about the celebration of some sort of utopian concept. This mere notion wasn’t even circulated until some white folks were made to feel uncomfortable at a party they had no business being at." You see, house is a feeling that no one can understand really unless you're deep into the vibe of house. House is an uncontrollable desire to jack your body. And, as I told you before, this is our house and our house music. Again, WRONG! And in every house, you understand, there is a keeper. And, in this house, the keeper is jack. Now some of you who might wonder, "who is jack, and what is it that jack does ?" Jack is the one who gives you the power to jack your body ! Jack is the one who gives you the power to do the snake. Jack is the one who gives you the key to the wiggly worm. Jack is the one who learns you how to walk your body. Jack is the one that can bring nations and nations of all jackers together under one house. You may be Black, you may be White; you may be Jew or Gentile. It don't make a difference in our house. Again, WRONG! "This bullshit illusion that dance music has no race, no gender, that its about the celebration of some sort of utopian concept. This mere notion wasn’t even circulated until some white folks were made to feel uncomfortable at a party they had no business being at." And this is fresh!!"

And this is Scott Ferguson's reply (white owner of detroit ferrispark records)

quote:

Wow! I could really go on about this all day. I’m just going to rant for a bit. I start off by saying that I think European and American perspectives on Black music are very different. I mean for one, some of the greatest jazz musicians had to go to Europe to play their music because Americans thought it was just “crazy Black shit� You can say the same about ‘Blues’ and ‘Rock N Roll’. (and yes African- Americans invented both, along with country, ragtime, swing, Disco, and most ideas of minimalism in composition) In America it took someone like ‘Elvis’ mimicking African-Americans to push Rock n Roll into American mainstream. Eminem for hip - hop. In Europe bands like Cream, Led Zepplin, and the Rolling Stones were outright ripping off black American music. The difference was is that they admitted it. All those bands were fans of what they were hearing from Black musicians in America, in fact it was what was inspiring them! They were not pretending to have come up with Rock N Roll. With Dance music its a whole other ballgame. Simply because Americans don’t know or give a shit about dance music weather it be Richie Hawtin or Derrick May. But I must admit that it took someone like Moby (white guy) to even begin to push it into the American mainstream culture. So when electronic music becomes mainstream in America you can count on it being a white boy who is the center of attention. I believe that a lot more Europeans know who Derrick May is. With that said, I believe Europeans know a lot more about African- American music. Check pop charts in England and France during the 60’s/70’s. (I could be wrong about all this) Major labels push white artists in America due to the value of their marketability. African-Americans only consist of 11% of americas population. Who do you think makes Jay - Z rich? Certainly its mostly white people. In fact why do you think it is that a African American rapper who talks about clubbin, money, and fuckin bitches makes more money then a rapper talking about the war in Iraq or social justice for African Americans? Most of white America doesn’t want to hear that shit, they want something that you don’t need to think about, something that is about what they like. Clubs, fucking, and money. Let’s face it, American mainstream culture would completely not exist without African-Americans yet American mainstream culture would never except African-Americans being responsible for creating it. White Americans have virtually made no original music, they have only twisted or copied African-American music. Who the hell wants to admit that? Certainly not the ‘greatest nation on earth’. Well I’ll tell you who wants to acknowledge it, Theo Parrish and many other African-Americans creating and inventing music. Also, I do! I was inspired all my life by music that Black people in America created and invented. I copy and mimic Black music every time I make music. I want my music to be like their music, and why wouldn’t I, its the root of almost all music I have loved my entire life . It was said that talent is talent. This is very true. White people make good music, Black people make good music, Latino, Middle Eastern, etc. All are capable of making good music. Every last culture and color can make good music. In fact the worst shit is as good as the best. It makes someone somewhere happy. It also teaches me what I don’t like and what I do like. The main difference is who has the money to market it to, and who is most marketable to a target audience. Is Richie Hawtin’s music uninspiring, unoriginal, and soulless because he is white? Fuck no, its inspiring, original, and soulful! Its black music! Don’t believe me. How is it that a blues song could be just a few tweaked A-scale notes that provoke so much emotion, that resonates with so many other human beings sadness. Its so minimal yet reaches the most complex inner workings inside a human beings soul. Is it not true that a few minimal notes tweaked on a modified 303 also resonates with so many human beings souls. Ritchie just feels what he does. You have to respect anyone white or black for creating (even if they are coping or mimicking) what is inside their soul. I gotta run… [Going out for beers] I hope this isn’t to sloppy. I was just mainly stating that I agree with mostly everything Theo is saying as well as you guys commenting but felt I needed to add my 2 cents.

"Is Richie Hawtin's music uninspiring, unoriginal, and soulless because he is white?"

I really thought he was about to call Richie out.

One thing that bothers me, often implicit in threads like this one, is the idea that black people have some kind of pseudo-mystical or biological connection to any music created by other black people, and only they can do it properly, while nobody ever talks about Asians or whites having any analogous connection to the elements used in the musical forms they've created, or any supposed "special abilities" that they possess to create music in those styles.

well this is a dance music forum and people of african descent have pioneered a lot of good dance music


we could talk about asians if this were a board for martial arts and/or meditation

i guess if we were on a messageboard about cartoons we could talk about the japanese

and if this were a modern architecture messageboard maybe we could talk about the swiss, french, and germans.



i think those are sentiments you have added into the discussion, that are not necessarily implicit.


i would be the first to admit my musical and cultural background is completely related to my difficulty making funky music. most of my stuff tends to be atmospheric and grooveless. my mom made me listen to soft rock, synth pop, and new age when i was too young to do anything.

lol, he appears to be the only racist.

quote:

Originally posted by nefardec i think those are sentiments you have added into the discussion, that are not necessarily implicit.

Actually, I was thinking more of the drift of Parrish's comments than of the posts made by people in this thread.

quote:

i would be the first to admit my musical and cultural background is completely related to my difficulty making funky music. most of my stuff tends to be atmospheric and grooveless. my mom made me listen to soft rock, synth pop, and new age when i was too young to do anything.

LOL. Crippled for life!

when blacks invented blues, jazz, rock etc, they were ripping off white people music in the first place for their creations to even have been invented. the same exact way hip hop artists sample rock or other popular white music and incorporate it into their tracks, this same thing happened when they invented blues, jazz, rock etc. they took instruments we used, sounds we used, etc and put their own spin on it. they ripped off us, we ripped off them.

even if theo wins this argument, does he really want to win this one? it will just add more racism into white's psyche; blacks are better athletes and now they are better at music because every form of popular modern music is because of them? when blacks are considered for a job opening, white people will think "oh well you know they're good at basketball and good at making dance music and heck every type of music us white people like is owed to them ... but chemical engineering? nah, pass on this one".

+1