quote:

Originally posted by VDub It seems that there may be some good news after all with this bullshit tax... The builder's we've been seeing keep "including" the HST to the price of the home.. Thing is, if the sale(tax included) price is $405,000, how am I getting charged HST if the before tax price is less than $400,000... I think that someone is def wrong here and I'm thinking that the provinces website isn't the wrong one... Are the builders trying to pull a scam???

My guess - and this is just a guess, it's impossible to say without seeing the contract - is that they are claiming that HST is included so they can later claim the rebate on it.

Every new construction contract in the GTA has a clause where you sign away all your tax rebate rights to the builder. The more tax they can claim is included, the greater their windfall afterward. Unless you're a great negotiator or have some great connections, you'll be signing away almost every rebate, including GST.

Rest assured that whatever the builders are doing benefits nobody but themselves. I'm sure they've found a way to screw you legally, though. If you're buying, get yourself a real estate lawyer, when you're buying a $400k home it's well worth the $1000 to make sure you get f*cked as gently as possible.

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I personally cant stand for Dalton. Never voted for that asshoel and never will, I would rather take a bullet before voting for that douchebag.

This HST is going to fuck so many people in so many way its going to be terrible. But people wont fully understand the scope of it until the tax kicks in this summer.

But if he even gets a minority governemt I would be suprised and disappointed, but in reality does anyone think this HST is going anywhere.............nope. Once a tax is introduced it is here to stay.

quote:

Originally posted by Sentinal I personally cant stand for Dalton. Never voted for that asshoel and never will, I would rather take a bullet before voting for that douchebag. This HST is going to fuck so many people in so many way its going to be terrible. But people wont fully understand the scope of it until the tax kicks in this summer. But if he even gets a minority governemt I would be suprised and disappointed, but in reality does anyone think this HST is going anywhere.............nope. Once a tax is introduced it is here to stay.

Gas prices alone will clear out people bank account. You're right, we are so fucked.

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quote:

Originally posted by Sentinal But if he even gets a minority governemt I would be suprised and disappointed, but in reality does anyone think this HST is going anywhere.............nope. Once a tax is introduced it is here to stay.

And just think, the HST will still be an open wound come reelection time; all a Conservative candidate would have to do is promise to reverse it and he'd win in a landslide. But it won't happen. Even the federal Conservatives only reduced the GST, they'd never eliminate it.

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Funny, but it wasnt too long ago that most people on this board DEFENDED Dalton to no end

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quote:

Originally posted by jester Everything in this country is illegal.

"Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery…" Winston Churchill

‎"If you have ten thousand regulations you destroy all respect for the law" - Winston Churchill

it has long been common for builders to include GST in prices. if you sign a contract without even knowing whether or not the price includes tax, well...

car dealers have often offered pricing that assigns all manufacturer rebates to the dealer. THAT is far more shady as the rebates are not constant (like GST/HST) and you could end up paying more for the same car vs. another dealer who charges a bit more, but the rebates go to you.

so I'm curious...

what difference does it make if GST/HST is included in the price and the builder claims any applicable rebate or if it's added to the price and you have to claim any rebate??? same shit...the only difference is in the marketing, is it not?

personally, given that the price here (411k) includes HST, shouldn't VDub be happy? If it were NOT included, it would be ADDED to the 411k and he'd only receive a rebate for that portion which applied to the price between 350k and 411k, no?

AFAIK, it's also up to you to claim a rebate if you are entitled to one:

http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/E/pbg/gf/gst190/gst190-09e.pdf

talk to your lawyer's clerk or the builder for guidance as they should be quite familiar with the rules and process.

The price of the house is $402,000 which they say includes the HST...

Therefor, the pre-tax price is $355,752 ish...

My issue is, how are they charging HST on a sub $400K house if they are supposed to be exempt???

And concerning the rebate, Aaron is right...

They'd rather not sell you the house instead of giving you the rebate...

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quote:

Originally posted by chinamon chinamon is INCH MOAN. LOL so fitting.

Last edited by VDub on Mar-31-2010 at 15:52

quote:

Originally posted by Jayx1 Funny, but it wasnt too long ago that most people on this board DEFENDED Dalton to no end

Where's the outrage for the Federal Conservatives who shopped and supported this initiative with BILLIONS in kickbacks to Ontario and BC?

quote:

Originally posted by daves Where's the outrage for the Federal Conservatives who shopped and supported this initiative with BILLIONS in kickbacks to Ontario and BC?

I understand the conservatives position. The HST is not a bad thing in the sense that businesses can rebate the taxes on inputs. What is bad is how the province has implemented it. The province basically erased all exemptions with the PST and also maintained the current tax rate. When the HST was brought in out east, they also lowered the combined tax rate to ease the burden. But not in Mcguintyland!!!

The HST was actually supposed to be a psuedo tax cut for business and a slight shift in how taxes are paid by end users. Mcguinty has turned around and used it as a tax hike.

What the feds should have done was to put strings in such as lowering the combined rate. But then again, i guess thats not their place to do so.

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quote:

Originally posted by jester Everything in this country is illegal.

"Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery…" Winston Churchill

‎"If you have ten thousand regulations you destroy all respect for the law" - Winston Churchill

Last edited by Jayx1 on Mar-31-2010 at 19:15

quote:

Originally posted by daves Where's the outrage for the Federal Conservatives who shopped and supported this initiative with BILLIONS in kickbacks to Ontario and BC?

I presume that you have proof of these "kickbacks?"

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quote:

Originally posted by DigiNut I presume that you have proof of these "kickbacks?"

he meant the cash transfers that they gave to the provinces in exchange for buying into the HST.

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quote:

Originally posted by jester Everything in this country is illegal.

"Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery…" Winston Churchill

‎"If you have ten thousand regulations you destroy all respect for the law" - Winston Churchill

quote:

Originally posted by VDub The price of the house is $402,000 which they say includes the HST... Therefor, the pre-tax price is $355,752 ish... My issue is, how are they charging HST on a sub $400K house if they are supposed to be exempt??? And concerning the rebate, Aaron is right... They'd rather not sell you the house instead of giving you the rebate...

no. is it really fair to say that when you don't understand this yourself?

GST/HST applies to all new constructions, period. rebates and transitional rebates apply depending upon the pre-tax price depending upon contract date and date of delivery.

to simply call it a "scam" when it's included or not in the contracted price or when a rebate is claimed by the builder instead of the buyer is to not understand at all the mechanisms at play.

just please talk to your real estate lawyer or a good agent who can clearly explain how it all works. it's admittedly not very simple to understand and haven't paid enough attention to know all the ins and outs myself (I'm in mortgages and there are enough ongoing changes in that industry with which to concern myself).

Last edited by MarkT on Apr-01-2010 at 03:14