No at all mate anything that can help me learn i am more than happy to check out, my bandwith is what stops me from listening to the stuff in the promotion forum at the minute

Didn't bother to read the rest of the thread, but:

Cut the top and bottom frequencies of the pad as much as you can.

This one is obvious, but sidechain the pad and the lead with a soft knee and the fastest attack possible. Try to make it sound unnoticable.

There is really not a ton you can do to prevent the frequency clashing here other than your typical mono and placement strategies in the stereo field. Obviously, make sure the pad and lead are primarly hitting on opposite channels for the most part. Keep stretching their distance until it sounds right. (I'd put the lead on the left channel with maybe a slightly delayed and chorus'd sound of it panned hard right)

Just keep fiddling with it using standard stuff and they'll eventually fit. If they don't, then the sounds are not meant to be. You should be able to make it work tho.

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quote:

Originally posted by Matt_Moor The lead sound has a Parametric EQ, then Reverb, then delay, then a compressor in that order.

! Trap detected. !

Use the reverb AFTER the delay.
The way you are doing, you are delaying reverb tails, crashing your mix.

Avoid this common error.

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quote:

Originally posted by PlasticSoul ! Trap detected. ! Use the reverb AFTER the delay. The way you are doing, you are delaying reverb tails, crashing your mix. Avoid this common error.

Excellent tip!

I didnt even think twice about that haha. Easy when you know how eh

Yes, you almost ALWAYS feed your delay into your reverb. And the compressor most likely needs to be the first processor in the chain unless you've got a gate going. Personally, I'd do it like this in your situation.

Compressor - > EQ -> Delay -> Reverb -> EQ (cut reverb tails, cut top and bottom frequencies as much as possible, finishing touches)

You may also want to take a bell on an EQ and scan the lead to find its fundamental and boost it along with the 2nd and 3rd harmonics. This will help it cut better through the pad. Make sure to use a boost friendly EQ like a Pultec or Trident.

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quote:

Originally posted by Stephen Wiley Yes, you almost ALWAYS feed your delay into your reverb. And the compressor most likely needs to be the first processor in the chain unless you've got a gate going. Personally, I'd do it like this in your situation. Compressor - > EQ -> Delay -> Reverb -> EQ (cut reverb tails, cut top and bottom frequencies as much as possible, finishing touches) You may also want to take a bell on an EQ and scan the lead to find its fundamental and boost it along with the 2nd and 3rd harmonics. This will help it cut better through the pad. Make sure to use a boost friendly EQ like a Pultec or Trident.

ahhh

i thought i was better to edit the original signal to remove the rubbish etc and then compress the final thing that i was happy with...

So this is infact the wrong approach and backwards ? lol

People really are going crazy with the ducking replies I mean it helps and I do it myself from time to time but its still not going to fix what he has in the slighest degree.

The first problem I heard was sound levels, there is too large a variation between the lead and pad. Either lower the lead or make the pad a little bit louder. You can also carve out more room using an equalizer properly, but I wouldn't even bother because of what I'm about to say next.
The second thing I noticed was just a bad choice of sounds. As reverbed as the pad is the lfos in the lead are throwing transients all over the pad washing it out almost completely. I'm sure the reverb before delay is just making it worse as well. Ducking and all that HELP, but at the level this track is at there are much more fundamental problems going on than ducking.

As far as the pad have you tried cloning it and panning one hard left and the other hard right? Then just shift one of them forward or back a few miliseconds, this should help widen the pad up a fair deal. I find stereo plugs can help but often they don't really push the sound as wide as it needs to go. HOWEVER, even with both the lead and pad in mono you should still be able to have them both sitting in their own seperate spaces and not mushed together as much as they are now.
Sure it won't sound as good as it can, but thats definitely not your *main* problem.
Your main problem is levels and sound choice, and an equal can go a long way too in this case.. just that I'd save the equal for better sounds. Even the lead I wasn't that crazy about, its very brittle and digital sounding. You need to warm it up quite a bit.

quote:

Originally posted by Stephen Wiley Compressor - > EQ -> Delay -> Reverb -> EQ (cut reverb tails, cut top and bottom frequencies as much as possible, finishing touches)

I think experiement with the compresor before the chain or compressor after the chain. Sometimes putting a compressor after a reverb, delay and EQ will make it all come together nicely and you get a fuller sound.

Although i admit in some cases it doesnt work.

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quote:

Originally posted by sm44 I think experiement with the compresor before the chain or compressor after the chain. Sometimes putting a compressor after a reverb, delay and EQ will make it all come together nicely and you get a fuller sound. Although i admit in some cases it doesnt work.

This is what your bus compressors are for mate

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quote:

Originally posted by Matt_Moor @asdfg what kinda of plugins can help with width? Or is stereo seperation the same thing?

some synths give you the ability to adjust the stereo spread of the detuned oscillators, increasing this will create a wider sound in the stereo field.
the following synths (that i'm aware of) are good at this:

virus
komplexer/largo
sylenth

similar results can be achieved by recording/detuning multiple times, explained here.

quote:

Originally posted by DJ Robby Rox The second thing I noticed was just a bad choice of sounds. As reverbed as the pad is the lfos in the lead are throwing transients all over the pad washing it out almost completely.

How can you tell there is transients so i can detect this myself in future? Like how can you say it is a transient 100% and not, say, a volume fader issue or an EQ issue.

Is there any way to fix transients on leads and pads, or is it better in some cases (like this one) to just find other sounds.

quote:

Originally posted by PlasticSoul ! Trap detected. ! Use the reverb AFTER the delay. The way you are doing, you are delaying reverb tails, crashing your mix. Avoid this common error.

Its not an error, its a sound design choice. Probably not the right on in most trance contexts, but if you're trying to create a big shifting atmosphere it works well.

@ the OP; I haven't listened to your mix (internet's capped), but I would look into making the pad nice and wide while keeping the lead down the centre. Also try to keep the pad in the low mids and the lead in the high mids, and also consider using a big long reverb on the pad, so it creates more of a wash, while getting a room verb and lesser levels of long verb on the lead. The room verb will bring it further forward in the mix if used sparingly and in the right way.

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