quote:

Originally posted by skip Mixing in key doesn't mean you have to stay in the same key all the time.

owned

quote:

Originally posted by DJ_Rafnel I do, generally, but i dont let it limit me. I use it more as a tool to build a vibe.

This.

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I voted "What's A Key?" Although, I understand the premise of mixing in key, I really don't know what key's my tracks are in, nor do I really understand the Camelot system or anything like that. I'd be interested in giving it a shot, but don't really know where to begin.

I'm not really interested in paying money for one of these key systems until I understand the basics a little better. Or, are these systems meant to teach the basics, and you go from there?

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quote:

Originally posted by cmay119 I voted "What's A Key?" Although, I understand the premise of mixing in key, I really don't know what key's my tracks are in, nor do I really understand the Camelot system or anything like that. I'd be interested in giving it a shot, but don't really know where to begin. I'm not really interested in paying money for one of these key systems until I understand the basics a little better. Or, are these systems meant to teach the basics, and you go from there?

If your going to learn about keys and apply music theory to your playing, I think your really better off learning proper music theory instead of the Camelot system which is really limiting. If you learn all of the relationships between notes and keys you will understand a lot more about harmonic and modulation principles with mixing and open up much more possibilities. The Camelot system is basically the cycle of fifths/fourths, but with numbers instead of actual keys.
If you're really interested have a look for the harmonic mixing thread as there's quite a lot of good information there regarding this subject.

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you can key records too you know....i don't really mix in key, unless i want to keep the energy at the same level.

that and sitting there with a shit little casio for hours upon end just to label them is too much for me

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I always mix in key and find it is really useful for me as I'm pretty much tone deaf

When you're mixing in the same key you can do ultra long layered mixes which is great. Or you can jump up a key and create an energy lift.

I find when I listen to pro dj live sets, and spot a really good mix, when I check the keys of each track, I find they are either in the same key, or are mixing up a key.

i do most of the time or at least keep it in mind and it drives me nuts when people try layering two totally dissonant tracks together for longer than a typical outro-to-intro mix. i.e. trying to create a mashup from two obviously different keyed tracks. like claws on a chalkboard.

another thing that upsets the musician in me (and i've mentioned this many times before) is the bastardization of music theory, the circle of fifths, intervals, etc via a "dj system" like camelot, mixed in key, or whatever those bunk systems are called. please fellow deejays, stop using that shit. it's embarassing. i remember the first time i played with another TA who used that system, he brought over his CD's covered in random numbers and his little rainbow-colored camelot mixing wheel printout. looks like a goddamned "twister" board game wheel, just without the spinny-arrow. don't be that guy, friends.

if people stopped using shortcut, nonsense systems such as those, and instead focused on learning a little bit of theory (as simple as spending an hour of your time researching in google) then we (especially the EDM deejay) might get a bit more respect as a skilled musician instead of being a human ipod. furthermore, learning theory allows one to grow as an individual and paves the way for the beginnings of production if he/she ever decides to do so. also, following those foolish systems verbatim will lead to problems- there are times when two tracks will conflict regardless of key; knowing your tracks and applying theory when applicable or necessary is the best method.

study intervals and how they work for ten minutes and you'll be able to competently mix in key- fourths, fifths, and unison/octaves especially work well with each other when layering (not just simple transitions). tritones, minor 2nds, major 3rds, major 7ths, not so much.

or play techno like jay and let the dissonant wonky bleep-fest begin.

quote:

Originally posted by Omega_Blue i do most of the time or at least keep it in mind and it drives me nuts when people try layering two totally dissonant tracks together for longer than a typical outro-to-intro mix. i.e. trying to create a mashup from two obviously different keyed tracks. like claws on a chalkboard. another thing that upsets the musician in me (and i've mentioned this many times before) is the bastardization of music theory, the circle of fifths, intervals, etc via a "dj system" like camelot, mixed in key, or whatever those bunk systems are called. please fellow deejays, stop using that shit. it's embarassing. i remember the first time i played with another TA who used that system, he brought over his CD's covered in random numbers and his little rainbow-colored camelot mixing wheel printout. looks like a goddamned "twister" board game wheel, just without the spinny-arrow. don't be that guy, friends. if people stopped using shortcut, nonsense systems such as those, and instead focused on learning a little bit of theory (as simple as spending an hour of your time researching in google) then we (especially the EDM deejay) might get a bit more respect as a skilled musician instead of being a human ipod. furthermore, learning theory allows one to grow as an individual and paves the way for the beginnings of production if he/she ever decides to do so. also, following those foolish systems verbatim will lead to problems- there are times when two tracks will conflict regardless of key; knowing your tracks and applying theory when applicable or necessary is the best method. study intervals and how they work for ten minutes and you'll be able to competently mix in key- fourths, fifths, and unison/octaves especially work well with each other when layering (not just simple transitions). tritones, minor 2nds, major 3rds, major 7ths, not so much. or play techno like jay and let the dissonant wonky bleep-fest begin.

Well said.

I mean I don't think starting off with a harmonic mixing chart is a bad idea, but please think in terms of keys (Am, Ebm, Bmaj etc) rather than silly abstracted numbers (e.g. Camelot)... you'll find it a lot easier to delve deeper into the theory to understand it.

And you will look like a bit of a bellend turning up to a gig with a printed out chart... memorise it if you must.

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