then sell some drugs or something. i had 2x cdj100 (later cdj500 and cdj800), djm500 (later nuo3), 2x sl1210 during my study period. just had to work my ass of and squeeze out money from everywhere. borrow from friends, parents, girlfriend, student-loan, work and all that shit. pay them later, u will get loads of cash once schools finished, u just gotta convince people that your worth it lol. pay with a credit card. seriously, get good gear the first time, its fucking important and saves you alot of hassle.

edit: if u seriously cant afford it then just skip the whole thing imo. numark and crap like that aint worth it.

quote:

Originally posted by MSZ i dont agree with you nelly, and thanks a lot of calling my advice the worst you've seen in a while when i was trying to help, congrats. i seen to have a cvnt streak on ta, this will be last time i try to help someone in the dj booth./crymode

Please grow a pair and take my comment with a pinch of salt, let me be dramatic every once in a while.
You've been here for years so i just expected a bit more solid advice from you.

When someone new to dj'ing wants to get into it and I have a chat with them. If i were to show them a midi controller and a laptop I'm not sure that'd be exactly what they thought they were getting into.

Controllers to me seem to be something dj's get into after they've (not paid their dues) but learnt the ropes when they realise they've hit a plateau and wish to challenge themselves again and or change things up a bit. Granted some might say why not skip that initial stage but to me i think it's vital that people go down that route for a little which which is where they learn about song structure, phrasing, intros and outros etc etc.

Yes of course looking at the wave forms blah blah would help but this isn't production. I would never want a newb to be staring at a screen waiting for a visual cue which is when he'd hit the play button on his midi controller. Only to wait for the next break down and again continuously stare at the screen as oppose to LISTENing to the track trying to HEAR the changes during the bars anticipating the first kick again.

It all comes back to the laptop dj's these staring way too much at their screens and not at the punters who have usually paid money to see you play/enjoy their night.

I'm not disagreeing that having the visual aids are a good way to learn things what i'm saying is that i don't think it's the best thing to start someone off that way. As much as i'd like to think every new dj i introduce to the art would grab a laptop and controller and never look at the bpm let alone the track layout on screen etc I know for a fact that they would. They'd use their eyes to dj rather than their ears. That's my main argument.

Laptop plus newby = Eye dj'ing as opposed to Ear Dj'ing.

The above is of course all my own opinion and no doubt half will disagree and half will agree slightly. Either way, stop being a blouse and take my comment on your chin. If you didn't bother your ass to post your comments in here I'd have never shared my points above which in the end of the day enables new readers lurking without having become a member yet to make up their own mind on who they agree with.

great elitest talk, and this is coming from someone who hates laptop djs, myself.

quote:

Originally posted by n3lly It all comes back to the laptop dj's these staring way too much at their screens and not at the punters who have usually paid money to see you play/enjoy their night.

you're talking about different things now, his goal is to learn how to spin, not to spin regularly at clubs at the moment... shit, you seemed like a cool mod

anyways man, no point going back and forth, i always seem to be disagreeing with people on here. ill stop. i was only offering my opinion which was slandered by you, and again by your must recent post. disagreeing with rebuttal is one thing... cheers.

Last edited by MSZ on Oct-13-2010 at 02:31

quote:

Originally posted by n3lly Worst advice I've seen on here in a long time. (Not having a go mate, let me explain).

A little bit harsh!

I see where he's coming from - you don't want to make things too hard for a beginner - for the same reasons that your driving instructor will teach you in a diesel hatchback rather than a Camper Van with a manual choke and a sticky clutch.

But on the other hand, in my opinion it IS very important to learn the 'fundamentals' of DJing: manual beatmatching using only your ears and really getting a feel for using the equipment and manipulating sound. In fact I even question how much of a true understanding you'll naturally absorb from using CDs rather than vinyl.

While the act of beatmatching itself might be easier on a laptop than with CDJs (using sync), the whole environment has the potential to be much more confusing than a simple pair of CDJs and mixer, plus it's too easy to fall into the trap of always using sync and then you miss out on learning a whole load of stuff.

Also, Traktor + decent laptop + audio interface + MIDI controller's a lot more than $150! Even if you've already got a laptop it's out of the budget we're talking about here.

The beauty of the kit he's suggested is it's cheap and simple. Not too many flashing lights and buttons to confuse you, just all you need to start mixing 2 tracks together. If that lot works fine when you buy it, you'll probably get at least 6 months out of it - maybe even as much as a couple of years (if you haven't outgrown them by then)


And can everyone stop suggesting $800 Pioneer setups to someone who's just said he only wants to spend $150? I'm all in favour of pro gear and in the past I've campaigned heavily against shit kit... I've always said that going for build quality is a much better idea than cheap features for reliability, resale value etc, but there's a limit.

In fact, when you're RIGHT at the bottom end of the scale, I'd say you're better off spending $150 and not having too much to lose if it all falls apart, than spending $300 just to have even more to lose if it falls apart. The threshold's probably about $500... if you can't spend that much, you might as well just scrabble some cheap stuff together and not worry too much about it.

Two quotes from highly respected TAs which have been posted on here in the past:

quote:

Originally posted by Allied Nations Start on ghetto equipment and you can play anywhere. All the "brats" I know who started with bomb equipment all just complain and complain when they are to play on a crappier system. Start on crap kit for cheap, and imo you'll be a overall better DJ in the long run.

quote:

Originally posted by Tony Morello Limitations inspire creativity

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Stu Cox |

edit becasue stu said what i was saying basically


that numark would work out fine for the OP, im assuming it comes with tratkor LE which is more than enough to get him running and is fantastic. (ive used both pro/le)

start out with cheap decks. you'll learn to appreciate upgrading gear much more. learn to beat match, don't start off digital

Most people would crack up if they saw the stuff I tried mixing with when I first wanted to get into DJing. An akai hi-fi and a sega maga-cd going through a tascam 4 track recorder and I had an old pioneer belt drive turntable with no pitch contol. Eventually I'd saved for proper techs and stuff though.

quote:

Originally posted by r5a edit becasue stu said what i was saying basically that numark would work out fine for the OP, im assuming it comes with tratkor LE which is more than enough to get him running and is fantastic. (ive used both pro/le)

It's a CD deck and mixer combo, no laptop involved (and hence no Traktor, LE or otherwise).

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Stu Cox |

quote:

Originally posted by Teezdalien Most people would crack up if they saw the stuff I tried mixing with when I first wanted to get into DJing. An akai hi-fi and a sega maga-cd going through a tascam 4 track recorder and I had an old pioneer belt drive turntable with no pitch contol. Eventually I'd saved for proper techs and stuff though.

Haha yep, I started off with a portable Bush CD-tape combo player, a Sony Discman and some homemade cables to plug them into an 8-channel studio mixer made by a bloke who lived down the road with his dad. My headphones were a pair of my dad's which he had left over from the 70s, which looked something like THIS.

I later 'upgraded' to a pair of THESE (fairly cheap JVC home turntables, not designed for DJs and bought from my design tech teacher at school), still using the same mixer.

As I didn't have pitch control I had to work out the tempo of all of my tracks using the metronome on a Yamaha keyboard then just mix tracks I knew where the same speed.

The first set of decks I had with pitch control were Kam DDX680s... the shittest direct drive decks in the world. I got a Gemini PS-646 mixer to go with them, which actually still works fine today with the exception of a bit of crackle on one of the low EQ knobs.

It wasn't until I'd been DJing for about 5 years that I got a pair of Technics.


And I turned out fine! (probably debatable)


Anyone else got any stories of growing up with shit gear?

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Stu Cox |

quote:

Originally posted by Stu Cox Anyone else got any stories of growing up with shit gear?

For my first setup I bought a Behringer DJX 700 lol. Maybe not as old school as some of your stuff but I only started DJing in 2006. Got two CDJ 800 MK2's with the mixer also, I didn't want to spend that much for CD decks on my first setup but thought it would be worth it and has been.

I've bought a new mixer since, after awhile the DJX channels would sometimes cut out or not work at all, effects were out-right pathetic and virtually useless - it was basically a mixer for me to learn the basics on and then move on. After that mixer I said I wasn't going to buy another Behringer mixer again and was seriously eye-ing off Pioneer's DJM because every man and their dog had one so assumed there was quality in it.

Behringer released their DDM4000 digital mixer, read and watched many video reviews and at a price of around $500 AUS I decided to pick it up and it's fantastic. Effects are actually useful and EQ's kill cuts out completely. Noticed a fair different from the analog faders on the DJX to the digital ones on the DDM4000.

I know a lot of people criticize Behringer for their mixers, I don't blame them for the DJX700 at all - however I can't really fault this DDM4000 , but at the same time I'm not that much of a nit-picker.

quote:

Originally posted by MSZ great elitest talk, and this is coming from someone who hates laptop djs, myself. you're talking about different things now, his goal is to learn how to spin, not to spin regularly at clubs at the moment... shit, you seemed like a cool mod anyways man, no point going back and forth, i always seem to be disagreeing with people on here. ill stop. i was only offering my opinion which was slandered by you, and again by your must recent post. disagreeing with rebuttal is one thing... cheers.

Please go sulk somewhere else.

"His goal is to learn how to spin" you say. Yet you're advising him on going down the route of clicking sync buttons while looking at a laptop screen to see if the wave forms align correctly and looking at the structure of a song.

My point was way too long above all i meant to say was use your ears. Learn with them first add the shiny stuff later on. That way when you rock up to a party later on with your mates and people start going around saying you're their DJ friend and you get offered to have a go on whatever gear they have there, you'll be able to get up there and have a laugh compared to asking the dj where the sync button is.

quote:

Originally posted by MSZ shit, you seemed like a cool mod

I've rarely been harsh or angry but the fact that you moan on so much just irritates me. Granted my initial comment was a little black and white when perhaps I could have softened it up a little, and maybe fluffed my response up a little but I genuinely still believe suggesting someone get into dj'ing by buying a midi controller and a laptop dj'ing program is just 'insert harsh comment'.

If you always seem to be disagreeing with people on here maybe that's saying something..

I take pride in the mod i've been on here (granted i've had to do fuck all) but man up next time and don't just call me elitist and ignorant because i was a little harsh towards you.

OP Buy some second hand decks/cdj's. A mixer. Practice your heart out. Once you feel ready for the next step and haven't lost interest, take the next step and buy some better gear. As has been suggested by others as well.

EDIT: This thread is the equivalent of my time of month. Please do excuse anything anyone might have taken as offensive/elitist/ignorant/harsh.. 95% of the time I'm not bleeding between my legs.