moff - "i swear, on my mothers life.. im havin the best time.. bein off my pickle, and feelin the music"

if it works for him .. =)

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Recently released:
Aesthetic - Twilight Sky [Primal-Recordings]

http://www.wtfnews.org

Paulie: I understand what you're saying, and I think there's some truth to it. However, the notion that drugs do long-term physical, psychological and neurological harm is implicit in (and essential to) your argument, and this hasn't been *proven* to be the case. After all, tobacco smoking wasn't the evil it is until it was proven to cause lung cancer!

Nevertheless, the chances are high that the recreational drugs used by people in the rave scene are doing some kind of damage, but at the moment its not quantifiable. So, ravers/clubbers (myself included) tend to focus on the good bits (music, friends, PLUR etc), and this filters down to younger folk, who simply 'follow the leader'.

The difficulty in highlighting the negative aspects of rave culture among insiders is that the negatives aren't so easily experienced, and so they are ignored to an extent. It's worth reflecting on this -- the scene is great fun, but it's not necessarily harmless.

Am I barking up the wrong tree, Paulie?

Forgot to mention before, no surprises this thread was posted on a Tuesday

It's quite easy for the mainstream media to get all hysterical about pill deaths, because it's something unfamiliar to them and is perceived as different. It's the phenomenon of "othering," which is actually pretty commonplace - but I won't go into more detail about it unless absolutely necessary

The point is, alcohol-related deaths are much more familiar and thus don't rate as much attention. The media will jump all over someone like Anna Wood, but some bogan who gets trashed at the pub and goes home to beat his wife or runs over someone on the way home isn't going to get anywhere near as much attention, even though he's doing a lot more damage to society as a whole.

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Paulie, a lot of your arguments rely on a *fingers in ears* LA LA LA LA! I'm not listening response.

Yes, there are negative aspects to drug use, so believe positive, and largely are pretty much a moot point.

Positive aspects of clubbing:

* enjoying a type of music with others who enjoy the same
* socialising with friends you've met in, out or around the scene
* developing a new interest in life (in my case, djing and sound eng)
* just having a ball
* relaxing all night on a couch letting music pour over you while you watch the crowd go wild

Negative aspects of clubbing:

* hearing loss (although in my case i'd already lost mine to chainsaws and tractors in the 80s before earmuffs were cool)
* being paranoid about undercover cops and dogs even if you've got nothing on you

[the above are all real examples from my real experience]

See, the thing is, all of the above can apply equally well to pubs, or even people going to a free concert in the park.

Don't make the mistake of letting one perceived negative on your part mask the positives, nor the mistake of thinking that a positive must be

a) linked to drugs (and therefore negative)
b) a moot point if it's also a positive in another scene

Yes, the drug use creates a negative shine on the scene to those unfamiliar with it, but that's a simple case of people being scared of things they don't know about.

A simple FACT: there are far fewer illicit drug related deaths or violence of any form than alcohol, tobacco or cars.

Does that make any of those ALL negative?

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I'm running! I'm running! I'm running! ... I'm naked!

Well i've never pilled, and i don't drink at raves, i'm open minded to the idea as long as they don't go overboard, and take their shirts off and start rubbing up against me

Trance is a very psychotropic genre of music, maybe even the most psychotropic of all mainstream music, for a number of reasons:

Repetitive music ranging between 45 - 72 beats per minute (close to heartbeat) the flashing lights, and the dancing all helps induce an alpha state of awareness in which your subconscious is more susceptible to suggestion - the people dancing around you (more often than not on E ) help trigger a collective sense of rapport through mirroring, then you have the anticipation of seeing your favorite DJ, anticipation in trying to guess the next song, trance crescendos etc. (the process is over simplified)

This is why most people who have a passion for the music can get a high without drugs, and this is why i have the best time of my life at raves. I also think that if you have pilled once or twice at a rave and then stay clean at the next rave you will get a bigger high than someone who hasn't pilled because the feeling of euphoria you experienced at a previous rave will serve as an anchor point to your subconcious.

Anyway, violent crime on new years eve has gone down ten fold since more people have been taking E than Alcohol

/end rant

quote:

LIKE I WAS SAYING TO HIM. I TOLD HIM: "TOP WITH ME AND YOU WON'T LEAVE."…SO I SMACKED HIM IN THE HEAD AND DOWNED ANOTHER CARLING - BADA BADA BING FOR THE LAD'S NIGHT.

The Streets - The Irony of it All?

quote:

Originally posted by tathi Repetitive music ranging between 45 - 72 beats per minute (close to heartbeat)

Trance is @ 133-150bpm.

--djway_TA

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:/

well there goes part of my theory

it will still effect you, i suppose mainly because of the crescendos and increase in tempo etc

quote:

Originally posted by bragi Paulie, a lot of your arguments rely on a *fingers in ears* LA LA LA LA! I'm not listening response. Yes, there are negative aspects to drug use, so believe positive, and largely are pretty much a moot point. Positive aspects of clubbing: * enjoying a type of music with others who enjoy the same * socialising with friends you've met in, out or around the scene * developing a new interest in life (in my case, djing and sound eng) * just having a ball * relaxing all night on a couch letting music pour over you while you watch the crowd go wild Negative aspects of clubbing: * hearing loss (although in my case i'd already lost mine to chainsaws and tractors in the 80s before earmuffs were cool) * being paranoid about undercover cops and dogs even if you've got nothing on you [the above are all real examples from my real experience] See, the thing is, all of the above can apply equally well to pubs, or even people going to a free concert in the park. Don't make the mistake of letting one perceived negative on your part mask the positives, nor the mistake of thinking that a positive must be a) linked to drugs (and therefore negative) b) a moot point if it's also a positive in another scene Yes, the drug use creates a negative shine on the scene to those unfamiliar with it, but that's a simple case of people being scared of things they don't know about. A simple FACT: there are far fewer illicit drug related deaths or violence of any form than alcohol, tobacco or cars. Does that make any of those ALL negative?

respekt.


No insults, no jibes, just a coherent argument, you my friend have won my respect.

But, the reason i dwell on the drug aspect so much is because there would be no "rave culture/parties" without the drugs in first place imo. SQ_K alos has a very valid point:

quote:

The difficulty in highlighting the negative aspects of rave culture among insiders is that the negatives aren't so easily experienced, and so they are ignored to an extent. It's worth reflecting on this -- the scene is great fun, but it's not necessarily harmless.

What frightens me is that the younger kids of today dont understand the fuss of the music, friends plur etc, all they see is people getting off their titties and hence they follow their leader. The frightening thing also is we have no known effects of the drug. That dont scare anyone?


Dont get me wrong i prolly have had the best nites of my life at these things, and prolly will still continue to do. As Ive said before its something id want my kids to stay well clear from.


ps Cheers for some mature respones.

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Oh, life is bigger ,It's bigger than you,And you are not me,The lengths that I will go to, The distance in your eyes ,Oh no, I've said too much, I set it up

That's me in the corner, That's me in the spotlight, I'm Losing my religion, Trying to keep up with you ,And I don't know if I can do it, Oh no, I've said too much,I haven't said enough, I thought that I heard you laughing, I thought that I heard you sing, I think I thought I saw you try.

But that was just a dream, That was just a dream, But that was just a dream, Try, cry, why try? That was just a dream ,Just a dream, just a dream, Dream

quote:

Originally posted by webmeister Forgot to mention before, no surprises this thread was posted on a Tuesday

haha nice spotting!

quote:

Originally posted by djway Trance is @ 133-150bpm.

On average our type of stuff is 130-145

Try dividing 130 in half...

65

Try dividing 145 in half..

72.5


Those are within the 45-72 range are they not.

If your heart is going on every second beat, that's still in time to the music.

I don't believe in theory completely, but would certainly make difference albeit a small one.

And tathi, nice psych study for your other points, spot on

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Needing a reason for being stuck in this seemingly demeaning whirlwind of ride with you

Ahh didn't think of that hybrid, i suppose you can also take into account the increase in your heart beat while dancing


I think Paulie also poses a good question about minors taking drugs, remember these guys are the next generation of ravers, what will Australias vibe be like in the next 10 years?

quote:

Originally posted by webmeister Forgot to mention before, no surprises this thread was posted on a Tuesday

corellation





the thread were based on some of the comments on other forums and on these about the movie One perfect day. What makes tuesday so special?

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Oh, life is bigger ,It's bigger than you,And you are not me,The lengths that I will go to, The distance in your eyes ,Oh no, I've said too much, I set it up

That's me in the corner, That's me in the spotlight, I'm Losing my religion, Trying to keep up with you ,And I don't know if I can do it, Oh no, I've said too much,I haven't said enough, I thought that I heard you laughing, I thought that I heard you sing, I think I thought I saw you try.

But that was just a dream, That was just a dream, But that was just a dream, Try, cry, why try? That was just a dream ,Just a dream, just a dream, Dream