quote:

Originally posted by arctic Unsupported assertion. By the way, when did I claim that I was one of the prominent theologians down here that opposed it? I'd really like to see what gave you that impression. My current position could be likened to that of an agnostic. I'm not saying that Jesus did or did not exist, I think it isn't possible to verify. If you mean 'do I believe that Christ died and was resurrected' and so on, then no, I don't believe in Christ. And yes, it is just another movie, one that I'll probably choose not to watch. Firstly, there are much better movies out there (The life of Brian, for instance ), and secondly, Mel Gibson is a bigot, hence me refusing to let any of my money get into his greedy little hands. Read the article I posted. Further to that, the only reason a lot of Churches are supporting is this is because they see it as a conversion tool. "You've seen the movie, now read the book" kind of thing. And yes, sorry to break it to you, but it is just another holywood flick. As for your claim that the plot doesn't suck, I disagree. It is of course entirely subjective, but I have read the book, and in my opinion, the plot does indeed suck.

You are an idiot, how old are you kid? such an arrogant, cocky piece of shit. damn i sure hate to argue with babies but in this case ill make an exception

first of all, the Pope is God's representant on Earth according to some christians and catholics. Im sure that qualifies him as knowing more than anyone who picked up the bible. There have been more religious occurences since the time of the bible such as miracles, appereances. You will ask for proof no doubt but fuck you, find it yourself, your so good at it.

Oh and yes i did read your post. In fact, ive read the Anne Catherines book as well. In her visions, the night before Jesus was taken to Pilate, Jesus was tortured by the Jews completely. If that would have been in the film, it would have been anti semitic.

You say you won't see the film, i bet you will and if you don't your the one missing out. Oh and Pearl Harbor isn't half the movie "The Passion of Christ" is, so bad comparison kid. Im glad you did say in my opinion though in your last paragraph. Thats a first.

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Originally posted by albertoR You are an idiot, how old are you kid? such an arrogant, cocky piece of shit. damn i sure hate to argue with babies but in this case ill make an exception first of all, the Pope is God's representant on Earth according to some christians and catholics. Im sure that qualifies him as knowing more than anyone who picked up the bible. There have been more religious occurences since the time of the bible such as miracles, appereances. You will ask for proof no doubt but fuck you, find it yourself, your so good at it. Oh and yes i did read your post. In fact, ive read the Anne Catherines book as well. In her visions, the night before Jesus was taken to Pilate, Jesus was tortured by the Jews completely. If that would have been in the film, it would have been anti semitic. You say you won't see the film, i bet you will and if you don't your the one missing out. Oh and Pearl Harbor isn't half the movie "The Passion of Christ" is, so bad comparison kid. Im glad you did say in my opinion though in your last paragraph. Thats a first.

Didn't you say you were agnostic? lol... you're almost fanatically religious, making nothing more than a bunch of unsupported assertions and fallacious arguments.

Please, try to refrain from the personal insults. Making ad hominem attacks against people who are known on this board to be very rational and very good debaters does not help your argument.

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quote:

Originally posted by DigiNut Didn't you say you were agnostic? lol... you're almost fanatically religious, making nothing more than a bunch of unsupported assertions and fallacious arguments. Please, try to refrain from the personal insults. Making ad hominem attacks against people who are known on this board to be very rational and very good debaters does not help your argument.

i am agnostic, just not on your standards of ignorance. Im just puting up a debate, that is what this board is about right? Besides why should i take your side? you guys make no sense either. What are my unsupported assertions and fallacious argument? i'de like to know. Fanatically religious? no, i just think its a good film.

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You are an idiot, how old are you kid? such an arrogant, cocky piece of shit. damn i sure hate to argue with babies but in this case ill make an exception

Personal attack

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first of all, the Pope is God's representant on Earth according to some christians and catholics. Im sure that qualifies him as knowing more than anyone who picked up the bible. There have been more religious occurences since the time of the bible such as miracles, appereances. You will ask for proof no doubt but fuck you, find it yourself, your so good at it.

unsupported assertions and fallacious arguments

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Oh and Pearl Harbor isn't half the movie "The Passion of Christ" is, so bad comparison kid.

You want to back that up?

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Originally posted by DigiNut When it comes to things like holocaust denial, sitting on the fence isn't good enough - dismissing a historical event of such magnitude as something that never happened is just wrong, and I think that if one of your friends started harping about how the September 11 attacks never really happened or that the war in Iraq never happened or that WWII never happened, you would probably feel the need to "correct" them. I don't have a source on him "not disagreeing" with his father's views, but how could anyone have a source on that? However, if you look at the information that is available, you will see that most of them say he simply does not have a public statement on the matter, that he neither agrees nor disagrees. The point is that we don't have a source on him disagreeing either, which would be fine if people weren't demanding it and hadn't brought the issue into question, but they are and they did. While it is true that Mel may not actively "agree" with his father, his lack of any public statement whatsoever on the matter would seem to indicate that he has something to hide. If anyone can find any evidence of Gibson publicly stating that he disagrees with things such as holocaust denial and blood libel, I will gladly retract my statement. Obviously one would not assume that a person is an anti-semite simply because they don't actively set out to prove that fact - however, once there is reason to "suspect" someone, once accusations are made, and once they then refuse to make any statements in their defense, they begin to look guilty. Read this article: I don't have a lot of respect for Mel or his co-producers anymore after reading it. It doesn't have specific evidence of Mel as an anti-semite, but it doesn't cast him or his movie buddies in a very favourable light, either. Personally I think this movie was a bad career move. But only time will tell.

I wasn't disagreeing with you. In fact I agree with what you said, I was just asking if there was a source out there with a direct quote of the source for further reference in future debates.
What did mommy tell us about assuming again?

why do i even bother...take it easy guys, later.

quote:

Originally posted by albertoR why do i even bother...take it easy guys, later.

Wait, don't go? Why'd you leave?

___________________
Whence September dusk grows crisper still,
with leaves all crimson conquered,
I yearn to shout,
and dance about,
and stick pickles in my honker...

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Originally posted by albertoR first of all, the Pope is God's representant on Earth according to some christians and catholics. Im sure that qualifies him as knowing more than anyone who picked up the bible. There have been more religious occurences since the time of the bible such as miracles, appereances. You will ask for proof no doubt but fuck you, find it yourself, your so good at it.

So let me get this straight. When Pope Pius XII maintained the public appearance of indifference and neutrality during the holocaust, and when he signed the papal concodat with Hitler in 1933, the Reichskonkordat, (which gave Hitler the political clout to pass the enabling act in exchange for the official adoption of catholicism by the nazi party), as God's representative on Earth, can we look at this as God's tacit approval of the Nazis? True, this was way before the holocaust, but being the omnipotent individual that God is, that action appears to have been quite short-sighted. But as they say, God works in mysterious ways.

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Retro ...

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Originally posted by occrider So let me get this straight. When Pope Pius XII maintained the public appearance of indifference and neutrality during the holocaust, and when he signed the papal concodat with Hitler in 1933, the Reichskonkordat, (which gave Hitler the political clout to pass the enabling act in exchange for the official adoption of catholicism by the nazi party), as God's representative on Earth, can we look at this as God's tacit approval of the Nazis? True, this was way before the holocaust, but being the omnipotent individual that God is, that action appears to have been quite short-sighted. But as they say, God works in mysterious ways.

You left out a coupla centuries of torture, inquisition, prejudice, anti-science, anti-logic, anti-use-your-f$cking-brain support you silly boy!

___________________
Whence September dusk grows crisper still,
with leaves all crimson conquered,
I yearn to shout,
and dance about,
and stick pickles in my honker...

quote:

Originally posted by MisterOpus1 You left out a coupla centuries of torture, inquisition, prejudice, anti-science, anti-logic, anti-use-your-f$cking-brain support you silly boy!

Well I figured that if I went too far back in time, I'd lose them.

Look at the other christian thread ... gone for one weekend and I lose out on so many opportunities to ridicule fundies . Seeing as how it expanded by 8 pages over the weekend, I'm have to wait until I get home to catch up and respond ... but by then 95% of the idiocy will have already have been pointed out. Woe is me ...

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Retro ...

quote:

Originally posted by occrider Well I figured that if I went too far back in time, I'd lose them. Look at the other christian thread ... gone for one weekend and I lose out on so many opportunities to ridicule fundies . Seeing as how it expanded by 8 pages over the weekend, I'm have to wait until I get home to catch up and respond ... but by then 95% of the idiocy will have already have been pointed out. Woe is me ...

Yeah, I had a peek last night around 9:00, and the darn thread grew 2 more pages after that! Truly amazing stuff being said. There's so many quotes worth keeping for later use - I started savin' a few just in case .

___________________
Whence September dusk grows crisper still,
with leaves all crimson conquered,
I yearn to shout,
and dance about,
and stick pickles in my honker...

quote:

Originally posted by occrider So let me get this straight. When Pope Pius XII maintained the public appearance of indifference and neutrality during the holocaust, and when he signed the papal concodat with Hitler in 1933, the Reichskonkordat, (which gave Hitler the political clout to pass the enabling act in exchange for the official adoption of catholicism by the nazi party), as God's representative on Earth, can we look at this as God's tacit approval of the Nazis? True, this was way before the holocaust, but being the omnipotent individual that God is, that action appears to have been quite short-sighted. But as they say, God works in mysterious ways.

Popes in past centuries have been very corrupt. John Paul II is a great exception from former Popes and in my opinion he has been a very good Pope, am i wrong?