First of all, it isn't always the couple's fault that they have an unwanted child. Condoms aren't 100% effective you know.

Also, I believe it's a woman's right to do what she wants with her body, not the government's. With that march in Washington this weekend, I keep thinking how Bush is taking this country back to Vietnam days. It's been 30 years since then and women still have to worry about their rights.

quote:

Originally posted by drizzt81 so you want the GOVERNMENT to regulate who can and cannot have a child/ abortion? In all honesty, this country still CLAIMED to be the land of the free. In China, people are only allowed to have 1 kid/ family. Therefore people opt to get abortions a lot of times, since they want to have a son not a daughter. I think that the government has no right to tell people how to live their lives. This includes choosing to terminate a pregnancy.

you needed to read above.. somewhere i wrote..



regulated in the scense of DR.s should have to report the number of abortions performed each year (this is not a requirement) Dr.'s should have to tell the woman the risks involved in the procedure.. etc.. all the same rules as you would any other surgery...

see because prochoice activists feel that by telling a woman that should is at risk of never having a child again.. etc... abortions are the only procedures that don't have the same surgical rules like telling a woman she could have complications and what they may be... most dr.'s do anyways.. but they aren't required to by law..

I think Dr's should ALSO be required to use a sonogram... every year 1000's of women have problems.. as bad as bladder's being taken out.. etc cuz.. again.. prochoicers feel that a woman shouldn't have to see her unborn child being killed before her eyes.. so its not required for a dr. to use a sonogram to be sure they aren't taking other things out with these high powered vacuums... thus resulting in some devestating accidents.. and deaths...


that was what i meant by regulations.. although i still think abortions should be illegal.. there is a FIVE year waiting list for adopting a newborn!!

quote:

Now I do agree that abortions should not be allowed to be done after the child has reached a certain stage. What this stage is, I do not know, since I don't know enough about pregnancy. Given my lack of knowledge about how abortions are done, I have no idea on how such a termination is actually facilitated. Could anestestizing (spelling is off I bet) a baby make an abortion harder/ impossible? Are there funds available for research into abortion practices and how much pain the baby feels? Even if there were, wouldn't many "pro-life" people object to this research in general?

prolifers and prochoicers have only made it worst for everyone by fighting...


right now.. i think everyone is loosing.. woman aren't safe.. and babies are slaughtered brutally.... so i must admit .. somtimes I'm like what the fuck can i do?!! absolutely nothing... cuz both sides hate my opinion!!

but i continue forth anyways... i still provide counseling (i've been trained) and i still help girls who need it! and ask for it!

And i've even been apart of and helped start the POST abortive counseling group in our area! ... there are soo many girls out there who regret their decision now.. and need some love and counsel to get over their loss... we're here to help them too..

I'm totally about love theropy and not condemning a woman.. i don't agree with her choice.. but its already been done.. and god doesn't love us any less for being sinners... "there isn't any sin greater than another..." so whoever said above that god should condemn them.. remember that the next time you lie to someone a stupid little white lie.. your not any better.... "you shouldn't cast stone from a glass house!!!"

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quote:

Originally posted by intelligent77 cuz both sides hate my opinion!!

I agree with you all the way... mostly because you iz real fit.

"as bad as bladder's being taken out.. "


Ok that is strange how do enter a uterus and suction a bladder out? its pretty much impossible, or if possible done in a very non-medical way. How many of you heard bothch jobs of women doing this on the black market? midwives brought children into the world as well as preformed abortions. They did it in unsterile, and dangerous ways. Trust me you don not wnat to go back to that method again. Also regarding the nervous system being intact at 8weeks that may be true, but the motehr usually is sedated w/ some anesthetic. I dont know the exact drugs but there are very few drugs that DONT pass the placenta into the baby. Therefore if mom is sedated chances are fetus is as well.

I am pro-choice because i am a woman and dont want the govt deciding what is best for me. What really aggravates me about pro-life extremists is that they lump everything togther from the morning after pill, to RU 486, reg abortions and late term abortions. All are very different and all have differnt medical reasons for it.

and the debate goes on

sorry....abortions are wrong....I believe it is murder and I understand someone will pull the what if the woman's life is in trouble, I'm told by a surgeon friend of mine about this and he tells me it is very very very rare (his words not mine). Now I'm not one to start a fight with an abortion doctor but I might hold up a sign and protest out. I rather just sign the petitions trying to ban abortions. I feel that abortion is wrong and I'll use my democratic right to vote to help decide it if need be.

If only you guys saw what happens to aborted babys, its absolutely horrific. Josy, from my understanding... the baby isnt just dismembered, according to my Health teacher, aborted babies are taken out, put into a blender, and thrown in a back garbage bag - picture that image.

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quote:

Originally posted by Coup Vlad wins. Flawless victory.

This is an issue used by politicians to divide us, when it has little to do with politicians. It's the courts that ultimately decide the Constitutionality of such issues.

I started a thread about that rally in DC in the COR. The size of the demonstration is what impressed me:

http://www.tranceaddict.com/forums/...threadid=178078

quote:

Originally posted by occrider Abortions for some, miniature american flags for others.

Why is it always some fat bald guy shouting at women to "get back in the kitchen" that represents the "pro-life" contingent at rallies?

http://www.comedycentral.com/tv_sho...withjonstewart/

Personally if I were a woman I would probably never get an abortion because I don't think I could handle the mental anguish, but after hearing Bush representative Karen Hughes call pro-choice women terrorists, I'm utterly disgusted by the "pro-life" camp's hateful rhetoric.





http://www.dailykos.com/story/2004/4/25/15470/5398


Karen Hughes: Pro-Choice=Pro-Terrorist
by DHinMI
Sun Apr 25th, 2004 at 15:47:00 EDT

The Bushies will twist reasonable opposition to any of their policies into an accusation of giving succor to our terrorist enemies. The latest example is Karen Hughes, who dove down and wallowed in the same gutter recently occupied by Secretary of Education Rod Paige. (Paige, you may remember, characterized teachers unions as terrorist organizations.) When asked about today's pro-choice rally, Hughes revealed that the administration would prefer that voters not distinguish supporting terrorists from supporting a woman's right to exercise control over her own body:

quote:

"I think that after September 11, the American people are valuing life more and we need policies to value the dignity and worth of every life," she said. "President Bush has worked to say, let's be reasonable, let's work to value life, let's reduce the number of abortions, let's increase adoptions. And I think those are the kinds of policies the American people can support, particularly at a time when we're facing an enemy and, really, the fundamental issue between us and the terror network we fight is that we value every life."

Translation: In terms of respect for human life, supporting pro-choice policies and politicians is the same as supporting al-Qaeda.



Do you think George Bush would make his daughters give up their reproductive rights, and tell them that the only form of "birth control" they can use is to analyze their cervical mucous?

I doubt it, but that's his policy for the rest of the world.

Last edited by DaveSZ on Apr-28-2004 at 07:25

quote:

Originally posted by Busy Child for all non catholic women, let them do what they wanna do.

Most Catholic women disagree with the Vatican (Miami Herald):


http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiheral.../8504858.htm?1c

quote:

With hundreds of Catholic politicians in the United States supporting abortion rights, the trans-Atlantic counterpoint was only the latest sign that the issue promises to be a recurrent one on the U.S. campaign trail this year. snip Among American Catholics, 56 percent of non-Hispanic Catholics and 59 percent of Hispanic Catholics oppose making it harder for a woman to get an abortion, according to the Pew Research Center. Support for additional restrictions increases among Catholics who attend church at least once a week, with 50 percent of non-Hispanic Catholics favoring further restrictions and 43 percent of Hispanic Catholics.

quote:

Originally posted by DaveSZ Most Catholic women disagree with the Vatican (Miami Herald): http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiheral.../8504858.htm?1c

true and we also have the problem with ppl who are catholics that shouldn't be. Its still murder imho.

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Sorry
Also... i'm not 50/50 on abortions. I feel that it's choice. I don't agree if the girl/women having an abortion is doing it because of a one night stand. simply because it was her choice to do that and she should take what comes with her decision. But, if a girl is raped and can't see herslef having the child because of what happened then i can see where she's coming from. i don't support it but i understand.

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Last edited by BxNemo on Apr-28-2004 at 14:43

dude thats fucked up.... EXITING THREAD BEFORE HATING BEGINS>>>...


sorry if i feel that either way you feel on this choice.... that this isn't something to take lightly!



i know plenty of pro-choicers who i'm even proud to say i'm friends with LOL.. although we don't agree on the pro-choice life thing... who at least respect HUMAN life and feel this isn't a choice that should be taken lightly or with jokes!.. Its death either way! The question isn't are we killing a life.. its does a woman have the right to choose so before the child is born....

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from the mouth of My Latino Brother with Another Mother --"FUCK YEAH LITTLE DOGGIE!!!"

SUPPORT YOUR LOCAL EDM DJ's, DO YOUR DDM (dance, drink & be merry)

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here's my take on this. what gets me is all the women posting here saying that it's their choice what they want to do, they want what's best for them. Do you seem to forget the "other half" of the "it takes 2 to tango"? What about what the guy wants? How can a woman arbitrarily decide that she wants to have an abortion and completely disregard what the guy wants to do. You're taking something that someone else had contributed 50% into creating. I'll tell you as a father of a 4 y/o daughter, had my ex decided to have an abortion, I would have wanted to kill her too. I mean that would have been a part of me that she "decided" to kill to try and make her life better.
Obviously, I lean more to the pro-life side. Yeah, I understand what people are saying about extrenuating circumstances like rape, and the crackhead hiv infected hooker thing, but what about the innocent child that didn't ask to be created? Is it fair to him/her to deny them life? I guess that depends on individual feelings.
Now let's compare 2 scenarios: Let's use the above vs. a couple that have had sex and wound up "pregnant". although I believe in the right to life, I could somewhat understand about a crackhead hiv woman having the abortion. I can't say that i completely agree with the rape situation. I can only imagine how hard it is for a woman to deal with something like that, but then to add that she got pregnant on top of that must really be pushing her to the edge, so to speak. But, having an abortion doesn't change the fact that she was raped and got pregnant. I hate to be blunt, but that's a fact. Now, does having an abortion help ease the pain of the whole situation? I have no idea. It's really tough. If the baby is born, 2 things can be true: 1 being that she would consider it a blessing in disguise and the bond between the parent and child will be amazing or
2: seeing the child can always bring back the surpressed feelings and images of the whole fucked up rape situation. IMO
Now as far as the couple who had consensual sex and wound up pregnant(I fit into that category)no one can convince me that abortion is the right decision. You made your bed, now sleep in it. Only citing my personal experience with this, I can say that when my ex and I made the decision to have the baby, it was the best one of my life. I can honestly say that I have become a better and more responsible person because of the decision of parenthood. The road was not easy thus far and I know it isn't ever going to get easier. I've overcome plenty of obstacles over the last 5 years, none harder to get over than finding out my ex-wife was cheating on me and thus making me become a 25 y/o single father. Trust me, It isn't easy. But that's what makes the whole situation even more gratifying, that I'm able to make it on my own. Sorry, I seem to have drifted off the topic a little. Anyway, I don't want to push my beliefs on anyone. I'm just stating my opinion and saying that I would consider myself pro life.

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