Civil marriage and religious marriage aren't the same thing, nor is there any compelling reason why they ought to follow the same rules.

There is no real debate on this topic because there doesn't exist an even remotely compelling argument against gay civil marriage.

quote:

Originally posted by Ang ' ela_ie SEPARATION OF CHURCH AND STATE. Argument denied.

Haha.

Anyone else think the "state" shouldn't be the ones controlling my marriage? Why do I need a damn license to get married? It's a right granted to us by God. Not man. God.

quote:

Originally posted by osuracnaes What makes them so different? I am drawing conclusions by comparing the two. Please, explain. You're throwing this word, 'biblical' at me. I won't go into my thoughts on the Bible/religion. As far as slavery goes, it is encouraged many times in the Bible. Ex. 22:2-3, Lev. 19:20, Lev. 25:44-46, etc. You say "it's not right." What makes it not right? My morals say it's right for a gay couple to have the same priveliges as a straight couple. Same sex marriage just feels perfectly fine to me, and I trust that feeling. I think a lot of people are the same way.

I know I threw it at you -apologies-

I say it's not right because it goes against my moral being. Aka conscience. I trust that implicitly.

However, I agree that a gay couple should have the same rights as a married couple - but you can't call it "married" because a marriage can't exist between two same sex people (in the sense of the word and the belief).

My .02, at least.

quote:

Originally posted by Seventil Haha. Anyone else think the "state" shouldn't be the ones controlling my marriage? Why do I need a damn license to get married? It's a right granted to us by God. Not man. God.

Because society grants you advantages if you are married.

quote:

Originally posted by Seventil Haha. Anyone else think the "state" shouldn't be the ones controlling my marriage? Why do I need a damn license to get married? It's a right granted to us by God. Not man. God.

the people of earth welcome you, tell us more of your strange ways

quote:

Originally posted by ResonantDrag the people of earth welcome you, tell us more of your strange ways

Oh come on...

Didn't you go to Sunday school? This is just another example of where the government gets involved where it shouldn't.

I forgot who said this (it was someone much greater than me):

There are two reasons a government should exist: justice to evildoers and protection from enemies.

Oh, and you don't need to get a marriage license to get married. Go to a church, fill out the marriage certificate, do the "I do" thing, and you're married. And it's recognizable by the government for tax purposes. The only thing a marriage license does is give the state permission to take your kids. They're state property when you get one.

quote:

Originally posted by Seventil However, I agree that a gay couple should have the same rights as a married couple - but you can't call it "married" because a marriage can't exist between two same sex people (in the sense of the word and the belief). My .02, at least.

Which is why I perfectly respect any religion's decision to not recognize gay marriages. It goes against their beliefs. I guess if you only view marriage as something religious, I can see how you'd be against gay marriage. Personally, I see nothing religious when two people decide to announce that they love each other.

But because marriage gives societal benefits, and society shouldn't favor any religion (or lack thereof) above another, I feel any religious argument against gay marriage is invalid. You say it goes against your morals. I say it's perfectly fine according to mine. What makes your morals better than mine?

(Sees answer coming....)

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quote:

I guess if you only view marriage as something religious, I can see how you'd be against gay marriage.

Yeah, that follows pretty good. If you only view marriage as something religious, you're an idiot, and if you're an idiot, you're apt to be against gay marriage.

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Originally posted by Arbiter Yeah, that follows pretty good. If you only view marriage as something religious, you're an idiot, and if you're an idiot, you're apt to be against gay marriage.

You just called a lot of people an idiot. Past, present and future.

That doesn't even justify a response.

quote:

Originally posted by osuracnaes Which is why I perfectly respect any religion's decision to not recognize gay marriages. It goes against their beliefs. I guess if you only view marriage as something religious, I can see how you'd be against gay marriage. Personally, I see nothing religious when two people decide to announce that they love each other. But because marriage gives societal benefits, and society shouldn't favor any religion (or lack thereof) above another, I feel any religious argument against gay marriage is invalid. You say it goes against your morals. I say it's perfectly fine according to mine. What makes your morals better than mine? (Sees answer coming....)

Well said. I do view marriage as something religious, granted by God.

I also agree with you on a certain level that it shouldn't be "religious" to love each other.

I can see where you are coming from that any religious argument against gay marriage is invalid. However, our forefathers founded our country with certain beliefs and such (some of them religious) - and I believe we should honor those. We're straying away from what made our country great when we start doubting the founding ideas of our country.

As for my morals being better than yours, certainly not. They're probably the same, we just interpret them different.

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Originally posted by Seventil You just called a lot of people an idiot. Past, present and future. That doesn't even justify a response.

Which is why you gave it a response, right? I hope you're joking, because otherwise you just proved my point.

quote:

Originally posted by Seventil You just called a lot of people an idiot. Past, present and future.

Logical fallacy: argument from majority.

A lot of people believed interracial marriage was wrong.

A lot of people believed slavery was right.

He's following your logic perfectly.

quote:

That doesn't even justify a response.

Indeed it does. He's following your logic perfectly. Please respond.

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Whence September dusk grows crisper still,
with leaves all crimson conquered,
I yearn to shout,
and dance about,
and stick pickles in my honker...