quote:

Originally posted by NYCTrancefan If you can't pay for it then rot for all we care is the impression that I am left with from your statement. Not every American is blessed with a high wage job and access to top notch healthcare. Frankly there are animals in America that get better healthcare than some tax paying citizens, what a shame. I think that most Americans can care less about socialism if that's what you are suggesting. The first thing you are asked when you step into the emergency room or see a doctor, What insurance do you have, they can care less what is wrong with you short of you dying. I guess its all wrong to expect decent care when you pay taxes, spoken like a true Bush fan.

Federal law requires emergency rooms to treat patients who come to their facilities. Furthermore, patients can demand to go to the hospital of their choice. Hospitals that offer specific services must accept the patients who need that specialized care. When it comes to non-emergency services, private hospitals have the right to refuse care, however, public hospitals are obliged to provide treatment. It's called the Emergency Medical Treatment and Active Labor Act (EMTALA)if you're interested.

___________________
Retro ...

Last edited by occrider on Jul-30-2004 at 16:56

quote:

Originally posted by xKaoSx Who made these people wealthy in the first place? Probably people who couldnt afford health insurance and spent the money instead on their goods or services.

Depends which ones you're talking about. Of course none of those "poor" people would have jobs if it weren't for the "rich" person that created them. Their work is voluntary. People generally attain success by making prudent, intelligent decisions, not by whipping the backs of the poor in a slave labor environment. Bill Gates doesn't pay minimum wage. He's rich because he created a product that you and most of the rest of the world can't seem to live without, not because he exploits people. He's also one of the biggest charitable donors in the world, if not THE biggest one.

quote:

Originally posted by ResonantDrag Anybody know when the debates begin?

I believe they kick off in September if I'm not mistaken.

quote:

Originally posted by Shakka I believe they kick off in September if I'm not mistaken.

I hope Cheaney doesn't have a heart attack before then.

quote:

Originally posted by occrider Federal law requires emergency rooms to treat patients who come to their facilities. Furthermore, patients can demand to go to the hospital of their choice. Hospitals that offer specific services must accept the patients who need that specialized care. When it comes to non-emergency services, private hospitals have the right to refuse care, however, public hospitals are obliged to provide treatment. It's called the Emergency Medical Treatment and Active Labor Act (EMTALA)if you're interested.

My friend recently went to emergency room with no insurance (Kidney Stone) was there for about 2-3 hours.

Bill was $4000

quote:

Originally posted by occrider Federal law requires emergency rooms to treat patients who come to their facilities. Furthermore, patients can demand to go to the hospital of their choice. Hospitals that offer specific services must accept the patients who need that specialized care. When it comes to non-emergency services, private hospitals have the right to refuse care, however, public hospitals are obliged to provide treatment. It's called the Emergency Medical Treatment and Active Labor Act (EMTALA)if you're interested.

yeah, that's true.. i once had to sit in the emergency room for eight hours with a non-insured friend while he waited to be seen by a nurse. He never did see a doctor that day, yet he was diagnosed with mono and pneumonia. The only option i had was to drive him six hours to his dad's house, so he could recieve treatment at a local hospital in that town (good thing his dad was an executive vp for ibm international marketing).

If bush wants to save face on this issue, he should follow up on his state-of-the-union promise of forming a small business cooperative to give group policies for medical insurance. If legislative action concerning this policy has actually gone through, i'll gladly eat my shoe.

quote:

Originally posted by xKaoSx My friend recently went to emergency room with no insurance (Kidney Stone) was there for about 2-3 hours. Bill was $4000

Yes well obviously if he has the money he has to pay for it. If not than the hospital can be sued for refusing treatment.

___________________
Retro ...

The speech was pretty good... but i thought Kerry was trying too hard to make it "big speech".

I was watching it all on CNN if any one else was watching it on CNN as well did you see the fuck up at the end? they had the organizer at the end talking on his mic saying stuff like "where are the fucking balloons.. .what teh fuck are you doing... drop em drop em... more more" that cant be too good for the campaign... im sure the republicans are gonna say soemthing like how can kerry run a country when he cant even run a balloon dropping hehehe..

also he fucked up in the middle of his speech he said something like "I will organise a FBI that actually engages in terrorist activities... i mean.... anti terrorist activities" hahaha I cracked up when i heard that!

Over all but I liked his speech.. I disagree with his promotion of the idea that the american government should punish companies that out source jobs... it sort of goes against his left wing image... but i thought the rest of it was spot on... I wish he promised huge amounts of funding for NASA but i couldn`t really expect it considering Bush said he would do it.?@?@

___________________
Ladies and gentlemen... we are floating in space!

"If you take the simplest, crudest notion of self-consciousness, I suppose that would be the sort of self-consciousness that a lobster has: When it`s hungry, it eats something, but it never eats itself. It has some way of distinguishing between itself and the rest of the world, and it ahs a rather special regard for itself."
Daniel Dennett

quote:

Originally posted by ResonantDrag yeah, that's true.. i once had to sit in the emergency room for eight hours with a non-insured friend while he waited to be seen by a nurse. He never did see a doctor that day, yet he was diagnosed with mono and pneumonia. The only option i had was to drive him six hours to his dad's house, so he could recieve treatment at a local hospital in that town (good thing his dad was an executive vp for ibm international marketing). If bush wants to save face on this issue, he should follow up on his state-of-the-union promise of forming a small business cooperative to give group policies for medical insurance. If legislative action concerning this policy has actually gone through, i'll gladly eat my shoe.

His dad was a senior vp at IBM and your friend didn't have insurance? LOL ...

I mean really, Cobra isn't that expensive. Especially for someone in his position/connections.

But you do bring up a good point. One of the problems with the patient's right to choose any hospital they want is that ER's of hospitals generally fill up quickly and become overcrowded.

___________________
Retro ...

quote:

Originally posted by occrider Yes well obviously if he has the money he has to pay for it. If not than the hospital can be sued for refusing treatment.

Well if it was affordable maybe he could pay it-

$4000 just because they ran some tests and gave him
a perscription.

If he did have coverage most of the insurance prob would of paid for it- but it's still $4000 the hospital is charging.

Shouldnt there be any separation for someone who has insurance and someone who doesnt?

quote:

Originally posted by xKaoSx Well if it was affordable maybe he could pay it- $4000 just because they ran some tests and gave him a perscription. If he did have coverage most of the insurance prob would of paid for it- but it's still $4000 the hospital is charging. Shouldnt there be any separation for someone who has insurance and someone who doesnt?

That's just the $4000 that's on the face of the bill. Rarely will a hospital ever collect the full amount billed for services. I look at my healthcare bills sometimes and it's regulated as such that the insurance company has a deal where they will pay for so much, and I am only required to pay a certain amount(typically $15). Anything not covered by me or the insurance company gets eaten by the health care provider.

quote:

Originally posted by occrider His dad was a senior vp at IBM and your friend didn't have insurance? LOL ... I mean really, Cobra isn't that expensive. Especially for someone in his position/connections. But you do bring up a good point. One of the problems with the patient's right to choose any hospital they want is that ER's of hospitals generally fill up quickly and become overcrowded.

yeah, we were young and dumb. he would have been fucked if he didn't have the resources available in raleigh.

the thing about the experience that erked me was that the er wasn't crowded. not a single ambulance arrived for the first five hours, two arrived all day. the waiting room consisted of us and some guy with a mullet in a wheel chair (he did get help before the guy with the mullet though)

cobra isn't expensive? another friend of mine left our company and his cobra payments were only $850 a month, what a deal! yeah, in three months before another plan kicks in, you only have to spend a little over $2500 to continue medical coverage. not a problem for upper-class citizens, but for the middle class (bush's "us") it can prove to be a little difficult.

I'm not pretending to have the answers to this problem, but to look at our present system as being fine is hardly an eyes-open approach. I'm growing increasingly weary of the "socialism, socialism" cries from conservatives every time this issue is brought forth. Should americans start screaming "facism, facism" every time we increase national defense spending? Where do we draw the line between big government and big brother?