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Trancer-X
mutatis mutandis



Registered: Jul 2001
Location: Shambhala

quote:
Originally posted by Q5echo
after doing some research on David Welna's report that morning of 9/11 in D.C. i have come to the conclusion that you have (not suprisingly) fallen into the conspiracy hole on that one Trancer-X.

shame.

what have you expected to happen all this time that exerpt of Welna's report has been out there?




nothing! thats what you should have expected.


Like usual, Q5echo, your lips are flapping but you're not really saying anything.

There were literally dozens of sources that came forward saying that they had been warning our government (repeatedly) of impending attacks. Do we really have to go through all of this again?

You say I fell into the conspiracy hole, but you fail to realize that when they block investigations and such it makes people nervous because they wonder why things are being covered up by the top levels of the government.

Don't you ever question anything at all, or are you simply content with your head buried in the sand?

Old Post Sep-12-2004 05:39  United States
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Q5echo
asymetrical scepticism



Registered: Feb 2004
Location: Dallas

quote:
Originally posted by Trancer-X
Like usual, Q5echo, your lips are flapping but you're not really saying anything.

you posted a radio bite of David Welna reporting at the scene of the Pentagon the day of.
you left that for us to figure out.
after doing a little research i found out that nothing happened of that report or Ike Skelton during three years of multiple investigations.
the only thing i did find out about that soundbite is that its posted on about a dozen fruitball conspiracy theory sights with about as much context and insight as the post you introduced us with.

quote:
There were literally dozens of sources that came forward saying that they had been warning our government (repeatedly) of impending attacks. Do we really have to go through all of this again?

fantastic! bring it the f**k on! what are you waiting for?
i want to see these "dozens" of sources warning our government of some jihadists flying airplanes into buildings. produce something. i'm sure someone within the Federal Government that is not in on the whole thing would love to hear it. i know i would because i'm so sick of being lied to.
quote:
You say I fell into the conspiracy hole, but you fail to realize that when they block investigations and such it makes people nervous because they wonder why things are being covered up by the top levels of the government.

i have to ask. who is they? if thats too hard of a question then... what are "they" hiding? specificity is crucial when floating stuff like this. if i fail to realize anthing, its because you haven't made your case well enough. "they" are about to be aquitted on those grounds alone.

quote:
Don't you ever question anything at all, or are you simply content with your head buried in the sand?

i'm a reasonable man. i can believe just about anything if the facts present themselves well enough. just like you.
believe it or not, i was as much a conspiracy theorist as you are.
i think we have had this conversation before.

Old Post Sep-12-2004 06:21  United States
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Trancer-X
mutatis mutandis



Registered: Jul 2001
Location: Shambhala

quote:
Originally posted by Trancer-X
NPR Morning Edition - September 11th, 2001

try that one ^^^


quote:
David Welna, NPR's Congressional correspondent (from the Capitol building as it was being evacuated)



"I spoke with Congressman Ike Skelton—a Democrat from Missouri and a member of the Armed Services Committee—who said that just recently the Director of the CIA warned that there could be an attack—an imminent attack—on the United States of this nature. So this is not entirely unexpected."

Old Post Sep-12-2004 07:05  United States
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Trancer-X
mutatis mutandis



Registered: Jul 2001
Location: Shambhala

quote:
Originally posted by Q5echo
you posted a radio bite of David Welna reporting at the scene of the Pentagon the day of.
you left that for us to figure out.
after doing a little research i found out that nothing happened of that report or Ike Skelton during three years of multiple investigations.
the only thing i did find out about that soundbite is that its posted on about a dozen fruitball conspiracy theory sights with about as much context and insight as the post you introduced us with.


fantastic! bring it the f**k on! what are you waiting for?
i want to see these "dozens" of sources warning our government of some jihadists flying airplanes into buildings. produce something. i'm sure someone within the Federal Government that is not in on the whole thing would love to hear it. i know i would because i'm so sick of being lied to.

i have to ask. who is they? if thats too hard of a question then... what are "they" hiding? specificity is crucial when floating stuff like this. if i fail to realize anthing, its because you haven't made your case well enough. "they" are about to be aquitted on those grounds alone.


i'm a reasonable man. i can believe just about anything if the facts present themselves well enough. just like you.
believe it or not, i was as much a conspiracy theorist as you are.
i think we have had this conversation before.


It would probably save you some time (and perhaps embarassment) if you simply took the time to do a search. This has been discussed on more than just a few occasion.

Here, I'll start you out with a few links that I was able to pull up in another window while I was typing this:

http://www.tranceaddict.com/forums/...threadid=199463

http://www.tranceaddict.com/forums/...threadid=122041

http://www.newsmax.com/archives/art.../19/64246.shtml

http://www.cnn.com/2002/US/05/15/bush.sept.11/

http://www.guardian.co.uk/september...30338%2C00.html

http://www.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS...911.commission/

http://www.npr.org/features/feature.php?wfId=1792823

http://dir.salon.com/politics/featu...bush/index.html

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/artic...12/MN229389.DTL

http://www.newsmax.com/archives/ic/.../5/232545.shtml

http://www.npr.org/news/specials/americatransformed/

Old Post Sep-12-2004 07:15  United States
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Trancer-X
mutatis mutandis



Registered: Jul 2001
Location: Shambhala

Willie Brown got low-key early warning about air travel

Phillip Matier, Andrew Ross
Wednesday, September 12, 2001



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



For Mayor Willie Brown, the first signs that something was amiss came late Monday when he got a call from what he described as his airport security - - a full eight hours before yesterday's string of terrorist attacks -- advising him that Americans should be cautious about their air travel.

The mayor, who was booked to fly to New York yesterday morning from San Francisco International Airport, said the call "didn't come in any alarming fashion, which is why I'm hesitant to make an alarming statement."

In fact, at the time, he didn't pay it much mind.

"It was not an abnormal call. I'm always concerned if my flight is going to be on time, and they always alert me when I ought to be careful."

Exactly where the call came from is a bit of a mystery. The mayor would say only that it came from "my security people at the airport."

Mike McCarron, assistant deputy director at SFO, said the Federal Aviation Administration "routinely" issues security notices about possible threats. He said two or three such notices have been received in the past couple of months,

but none in recent days.

Whatever the case, Brown didn't think about it again until he was up, dressed and waiting for his ride to the airport for an 8 a.m. flight to New York, where he was to attend a state retirement board meeting. That was when he turned on the TV, and like millions of other Americans, saw the twin towers of the World Trade Center crumble and the Pentagon go up in smoke.

Before the mayor was even out the door, District Attorney Terence Hallinan - - the man Brown said just last week should be recalled -- was checking in and offering help.

What followed was a conversation made up of equal parts gravity and formality.

"You know, you're the first call I've gotten on this," Brown said to Hallinan, as they were signing off.

With that, the mayor hung up and headed for City Hall. Along the way, he made the call to close all city buildings for the day and city schools as well.

He also talked with representatives of the Bank of America building and the Transamerica Pyramid, who agreed that because the structures were such high- profile symbols they too should be closed for the day.

Once Brown arrived at City Hall, calls were made in quick order to Municipal Railway director Michael Burns: "I want a complete backup in case anything happens to the subway tunnels," Brown said.

The Coast Guard: "To make sure the bridges were being protected."

And to the health, police and fire departments to make sure they were staffed for the emergency.

The last call went to Tom Ammiano, the mayor's longtime political nemesis and president of the Board of Supervisors.

"We may have to declare a state of emergency, although it's not something I want to do at this point because it kicks in all sorts of things -- but we may have to be ready," the mayor said.

Ammiano apparently agreed, because an hour or so later -- when the two sat next to each other at a city department heads meeting at the command center -- the call was made for only a "limited" state of emergency. One that would allow the courts, city offices and schools to close, but still keep the city pretty much in working order.

"What I want," the mayor said, "is for things to be to run as normally as possible, but sagely."

And for the most part they did. As for what comes next?

"With any luck, we'll be back to normal by tomorrow -- but with a heightened sense of awareness," Brown said as he sipped coffee with reporters at Citizen Cake on Grove Street.

But as for long-term safety?

"We can only do what we can," the mayor said, adding, "Hell, if they can't protect the Pentagon from attack, what can they protect?"

BART BLOCKS: Don't go looking for a rest room on BART -- they're all locked.

According to BART information officer Ron Rodriguez, a memorandum went out yesterday ordering all station rest rooms to be locked until further notice. They've also put out the word to watch for suspicious packages.

THE OTHER BROWN: Over in Oakland, Mayor Jerry Brown was trying his best to keep things normal as well.

"We're carrying on," Brown said. "I think the most important thing is for people to stay calm and understand that the power of terrorism is psychological.

"The goal is to sow disunity and to undermine our faith in the leadership of the country."

A few blocks away, Democratic pollster Paul Maslin sat in his office high- rise and wondered about the long-term effect of the attacks.

"It's like one part Pearl Harbor, one part Northern Ireland and one part I don't know what," was how Maslin summed it up.

Maslin -- who does polling for Gov. Gray Davis, among others -- said the strangest call he got yesterday was from one of the biggest Democratic consultants in Washington, D.C., who had just bolted his apartment.

"This was a grown man in his 50s, and he was scared out of his wits because he'd heard that a second plane was headed for the Pentagon," Maslin said.

"We can't even begin to gauge the long-term effects of this yet, but I will say, I don't think we'll ever be the same."

quote:

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/artic...12/MN229389.DTL

Old Post Sep-12-2004 07:20  United States
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Q5echo
asymetrical scepticism



Registered: Feb 2004
Location: Dallas

quote:
Originally posted by Trancer-X
It would probably save you some time (and perhaps embarassment) if you simply took the time to do a search. This has been discussed on more than just a few occasion.

Here, I'll start you out with a few links that I was able to pull up in another window while I was typing this:

http://www.tranceaddict.com/forums/...threadid=199463

http://www.tranceaddict.com/forums/...threadid=122041

http://www.newsmax.com/archives/art.../19/64246.shtml

http://www.cnn.com/2002/US/05/15/bush.sept.11/

http://www.guardian.co.uk/september...30338%2C00.html

http://www.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS...911.commission/

http://www.npr.org/features/feature.php?wfId=1792823

http://dir.salon.com/politics/featu...bush/index.html

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/artic...12/MN229389.DTL

http://www.newsmax.com/archives/ic/.../5/232545.shtml

http://www.npr.org/news/specials/americatransformed/

none of this is in dispute much less "embarassing"

you've proven that we didn't connect the proverbial dots

i gave you too much credit. sorry

Old Post Sep-12-2004 07:39  United States
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Trancer-X
mutatis mutandis



Registered: Jul 2001
Location: Shambhala

quote:
Originally posted by Q5echo

you've proven that we didn't connect the proverbial dots



Attempts at TRYING to connect the dots were severely hindered.

Why were the investigations blocked after the fact?


http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tm...s_attacks_saudi

http://www.time.com/time/covers/1101020603/memo.html

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0%2C2933%2C63953%2C00.html

http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/9584265.htm

http://www.weeklystandard.com/Conte...02/948zywaf.asp

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0%2C2933%2C63953%2C00.html

http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/5792329.htm

http://www.indymedia.org.uk/en/2002/09/40960.html

http://www.guardian.co.uk/september...94933%2C00.html

http://www.opctj.org/news/peoples-w...004-175336.html

http://www.alternet.org/story/14659

http://www.monitor.net/monitor/0305a/911stonewall.html

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/col...0p-190107c.html

http://www.independent-media.tv/ite...r%20on%20Terror

http://www.newsmax.com/archives/art.../6/221945.shtml

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0%2C2933%2C54583%2C00.html

Old Post Sep-12-2004 08:22  United States
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Q5echo
asymetrical scepticism



Registered: Feb 2004
Location: Dallas

quote:
Originally posted by Trancer-X
http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tm...s_attacks_saudi

http://www.time.com/time/covers/1101020603/memo.html

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0%2C2933%2C63953%2C00.html

http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/9584265.htm

http://www.weeklystandard.com/Conte...02/948zywaf.asp

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0%2C2933%2C63953%2C00.html

http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/5792329.htm

http://www.indymedia.org.uk/en/2002/09/40960.html

http://www.guardian.co.uk/september...94933%2C00.html

IMO Bob Grahm is playing a little partisaned politics in a overheated election year. but we'll see how it plays out. i'm willing to debate that further until then.

your right about the FBI totally clusterf**king capturing Moussaoui and not linking that other dude 30 days before 911 and not, what i consider, following through.
Rowley was right and if it wasn't for her there wouldn't have been a 911 commission to tell Mueller that he was all f**ked up.
and the only reason he didn't lose his job was because middle management were the ones who prevented granting the search warrants to the Minneapolis agents.

quote:
http://www.opctj.org/news/peoples-w...004-175336.html

http://www.alternet.org/story/14659

http://www.monitor.net/monitor/0305a/911stonewall.html

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/col...0p-190107c.html

http://www.independent-media.tv/ite...r%20on%20Terror

http://www.newsmax.com/archives/art.../6/221945.shtml

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0%2C2933%2C54583%2C00.html

this stuff is mild drivel with a little bit of Henry Kissenger thrown in

Old Post Sep-12-2004 09:22  United States
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sensorium
Supreme tranceaddict



Registered: Jun 2004
Location:

Instead of posting so many links, wouldn't it be beter to quote the most important points of the articles? And of course, putting the link to the source along with the respective quote. Is it too much to ask for? Or am I that lazy?


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Old Post Sep-13-2004 01:04  United States
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Q5echo
asymetrical scepticism



Registered: Feb 2004
Location: Dallas

i kinda baited him to do that. something he does not normally do.

you can blame me

Old Post Sep-13-2004 01:21  United States
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sensorium
Supreme tranceaddict



Registered: Jun 2004
Location:

Okay.


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Old Post Sep-13-2004 03:00  United States
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