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Originally posted by tecnolover First let me just correct something I said on my last post, I said Indonesia was a 'western' nation. My mistake. It was attacked by terrorists but it is not a western culture. Indonesia has the largest muslim pop in the world. Now to comment on the above post. Spain and many of these other nations who have been victims of Islamic terrorists were peaceful too. That didn't make them immunce to attacks did it?? IMO the more peaceful a nation you are the more vulnerable you are to an attack. and the more effective that terror is on the population. the perfect example is Spain. They fell apart after that attack. It was pitiful. The terrorists were victorious. Spain didn't have the backbone and courage to stand up against these bullies. I love Spain, been there twice on vacation and it's beautiful yet I'm so dissapointed in them these days. Did you see the US back down after sept 11?? My opinion- Pres. Bush is the strongest US president since FDR in 50's. Thats right. I believe he will go down in history as one of the greatest US presidents. Great presidents and leaders most often come out of catastrophe. FDR and with world war 2 and Pearl Harbor and the depression. Abraham Lincoln and slavery and civil war. Washington with the Revolutionary war, Madison and the war of 1812. The best presidents were strong leaders who like Bush, had conviction and vision. These were also spiritually strong men with strong faith in God and christianity. Their actions or decisions weren't always the most popular but they stood their ground and later history shown that their actions shaped the future of their nation for the better. enough said.

Those are some pretty strong words, as well as an incredibly strong comparison to FDR. So in all fairness, I'd like to ask you what specifically you feel is Bush's strong points and why. Be specific. You have mentioned spirituality as a strong point here, but I feel I should address this in my response to your list of strong points.

Thanks.

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Whence September dusk grows crisper still,
with leaves all crimson conquered,
I yearn to shout,
and dance about,
and stick pickles in my honker...

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Originally posted by tecnolover Spain and many of these other nations who have been victims of Islamic terrorists were peaceful too. That didn't make them immunce to attacks did it?? IMO the more peaceful a nation you are the more vulnerable you are to an attack.

Pardon me for stating something obvious, but wasn't Spain part of that coalition of the willing? Don't you think that was why they were attacked by terrorists? Peaceful? By being part of that coalition, their government threw peace out the door and declared war on Iraq.

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Originally posted by MisterOpus1 Those are some pretty strong words, as well as an incredibly strong comparison to FDR. So in all fairness, I'd like to ask you what specifically you feel is Bush's strong points and why. Be specific. You have mentioned spirituality as a strong point here, but I feel I should address this in my response to your list of strong points. Thanks.

There are many but I won't list them all here. The one I will mention is his 'vision'.

All great american presidents had a vision of something. no I don't necessarily mean a vision or revelation from God (although this certainly is possible) or anything but maybe somekind of hope or dream
that they stood by in the midst of challenges and opposition. I believe Bush has the same vision for Iraq as Reagan had for the Soviet Union. A spread of democracy and freedom. Ultimately this leads to peace, but requires blood along the way. Democracy is contagious, just look at Europe, look at Canada. When people taste freedom they want more and traditional cultures disintegrate even religions. Bush understands this very clear and knows that if Iraq becomes successful democracy it's going to spread like wildfire through the middle east. This is Islams worst nightmare! Bush talked about a war against terror and I thought to myself 'no way' not possible. It's like the war on drugs. Too big a situation and too far spread. No way, not gonna happen. I felt like it was just a rally speech after sept.11 . Well it wasn't. What Bush and his admin have done was strategically ingenius. There are two battles going on here. One against Islam and one for a democracy. I honestly don't think very many ppl in the US felt confident that any of this was possible. Yet our military is performing awsomely. Our plan to turn over power to Iraq is gradually becomming a reality. Saddam was captured. Huge change in Aphganistan. These are all things ppl said and most of us thought couldn't happen and yet they have with the leadership of Bush. He is stronger than his father. Keep in mind I said 'strongest' president since FDR not necessarily greatest. I think Reagan was a truly great president. I would list him among those great presidents that I listed. However IMO, Bush is a stronger leader. I don't think anything can shake him. He's as rock solid as they come.

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Originally posted by EvilDust Pardon me for stating something obvious, but wasn't Spain part of that coalition of the willing? Don't you think that was why they were attacked by terrorists? Peaceful? By being part of that coalition, their government threw peace out the door and declared war on Iraq.

My point is that any nation that is 'western' is an enemy is Islam. If you don't believe this just study Islam sometime. So whether a nation joins the US coalition or not doesn't matter. If you are 'western' you are their enemy and they will attack you. end of story.

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Originally posted by tecnolover There are many but I won't list them all here. The one I will mention is his 'vision'. All great american presidents had a vision of something. no I don't necessarily mean a vision or revelation from God (although this certainly is possible) or anything but maybe somekind of hope or dream that they stood by in the midst of challenges and opposition. I believe Bush has the same vision for Iraq as Reagan had for the Soviet Union. A spread of democracy and freedom. Ultimately this leads to peace, but requires blood along the way. Democracy is contagious, just look at Europe, look at Canada. When people taste freedom they want more and traditional cultures disintegrate even religions. Bush understands this very clear and knows that if Iraq becomes successful democracy it's going to spread like wildfire through the middle east. This is Islams worst nightmare! Bush talked about a war against terror and I thought to myself 'no way' not possible. It's like the war on drugs. Too big a situation and too far spread. No way, not gonna happen. I felt like it was just a rally speech after sept.11 . Well it wasn't. What Bush and his admin have done was strategically ingenius. There are two battles going on here. One against Islam and one for a democracy. I honestly don't think very many ppl in the US felt confident that any of this was possible. Yet our military is performing awsomely. Our plan to turn over power to Iraq is gradually becomming a reality. Saddam was captured. Huge change in Aphganistan. These are all things ppl said and most of us thought couldn't happen and yet they have with the leadership of Bush. He is stronger than his father. Keep in mind I said 'strongest' president since FDR not necessarily greatest. I think Reagan was a truly great president. I would list him among those great presidents that I listed. However IMO, Bush is a stronger leader. I don't think anything can shake him. He's as rock solid as they come.

I think you're confusing "strong" with "oblivious".
After all, God told Bush to invade Iraq.

"Yet our military is performing awesomely"

Yea- my steak knife goes through butter "awesomely" too.

He is not "stronger" he is just more stubborn. His own minions have their own agendas and they tell him what he wants to hear.

We are at the lowest point of respect in the world that I can ever remember. I really cant imagine it getting worse. Just when you think it couldn't get any worse though- it does.

___________________
I've never felt alone... 'Till I met you

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Originally posted by tecnolover My point is that any nation that is 'western' is an enemy is Islam. If you don't believe this just study Islam sometime. So whether a nation joins the US coalition or not doesn't matter. If you are 'western' you are their enemy and they will attack you. end of story.

can you give an example of a peaceful 'western' nation that has no involvement whatsoever in the middle east conflicts and does not treat its Islam recidents unfairly but still got attacked by Islam terrorism?

please tell me this technolover guy is a part of some joke.


his words are quite possibly the most pathetic and misinformed words I have ever had the displeasure of reading.

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Originally posted by xKaoSx He is not "stronger" he is just more stubborn. Yeh, well being stubborn is a big part of being a strong leader. We are at the lowest point of respect in the world that I can ever remember. I really cant imagine it getting worse. Just when you think it couldn't get any worse though- it does.

I think you have been listening to way too much liberal media pal. Durring a election campaing as this there has been all kinds of negativity spewed out to the american citizens by the liberal media and I hope you don't believe it. And I can very much imagine things getting worse if Kerry becomes commander in cheif.

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Originally posted by Matt please tell me this technolover guy is a part of some joke. his words are quite possibly the most pathetic and misinformed words I have ever had the displeasure of reading.

Ok, i am part of some joke. Does that make you feel better? Obviously, you enjoy living in your little make believe reality. When you decide to open you eyes and start seeing something other than what your liberal canadian buddies are showing you and you have something meaingful to say in this forum other than just a simple minded insult we'll chat. Until then take care.

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Originally posted by tecnolover Ok, i am part of some joke. Does that make you feel better? Obviously, you enjoy living in your little make believe reality. When you decide to open you eyes and start seeing something other than what your liberal canadian buddies are showing you and you have something meaingful to say in this forum other than just a simple minded insult we'll chat. Until then take care.

lol, he says I live in a make believe reality!

hmmm... it's 8am, I gotta head to work. I'll tear this guy's arguments to pieces later... debating whether its even worth the effort.

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