Another related thing to keep in mind:

The mixdown IS half of how good the track sounds. (trust me, go turn off all your fx processors and fuck up the volumes of channels and listen to your track ). In the first few months (for me, anyway), you WILL NOT be able to get that good mixdown, even though you know it sounds terrible; you have to develop an ear for it (and you will, it's just experience). So there's a split between the amount you are improving your arrangement/composition and the amount you're improving your mixing ability.

quote:

Originally posted by RIPassion Another related thing to keep in mind: The mixdown IS half of how good the track sounds. (trust me, go turn off all your fx processors and fuck up the volumes of channels and listen to your track ). In the first few months (for me, anyway), you WILL NOT be able to get that good mixdown, even though you know it sounds terrible; you have to develop an ear for it (and you will, it's just experience). So there's a split between the amount you are improving your arrangement/composition and the amount you're improving your mixing ability.

given that...do you think it's important to just first get down the structure of a song and then work on the blending of sound?

Well, I like to have fun doing it, and if I set a bunch of rules about order of doing things, I'd probably drive myself insane, so I actually don't have any set way. Some of my best production ideas have arisen from COMPLETE accidents.

But, since I've still got a lot to learn (I have about a year under my belt), I hop back and forth between mixing/composing/arranging/you name it. A good way to teach focus only on mixing would be to find a midi of a track you know well (or write it out yourself) and completely copy the arranging of the track that the original artist used, and then all your focus will be on mixing your sounds.

Another method I came up with to listen to my tracks' mixing is to wire my sound card through the left channel of my mixer (djm300), and slam a record of the mixing style I'm aiming for on a turntable through the right channel, and then play my track and the record at once, using the crossfader to fade between them quickly. When I listen 16 bars of the record and then switch over to my track, about 10 different problems will hit me all at once, at which point I go to try and fix them. Then I keep repeating until I think I have it down. However, after a year, I now notice SO many more problems with my mixes when I crossfade over than I did before. You just have to keep at it, and you'll keep noticing problems with your mixes

For example, when I first started, I honestly couldn't tell any difference between raising a fader +/- 4db, and I couldn't tell a difference between equalization of a set frequency for +/- 10 db. Now I can tell the difference between 1db fading and 1db of any frequency, and I don't even know how it happened. You just become more aware of it subconciously with every track you produce... it's crazy. Lots of people will say "if you don't think a track is going anywhere, just start over" etc. I think this holds true only after a certain amount of producing. At first, I think you need to just keep making a bunch of full tracks, no matter how crappy they are. People get upset when their first track isn't Cafe del Mar. Man, I'd for you guys to hear my first track :P (I laughed out loud last time I heard it... wtf was I thinking?!) But I got a lot out of it. And that's the point when you're starting - practice, practice, practice.

If you stop a track and don't like it, DO NOT delete it. I skim through all my little 8 bar phrases I've ever made every few weeks, and they encourage me and remind me of old ideas I may have forgotten

It's so hard to try to give rational rules for such an irrational topic, so I hope this helps

Last edited by RIPassion on Feb-13-2005 at 20:00

As a bit of a novice to production this is all good advice. What I've realised though is that production is a lot about
'tricks of the trade'. Either through doing it myself, tutorials or learning from someone else I've been picking up little bits of knowledge about howing to compose, produce sounds, and engineer.

You cant expect to know all this stuff straight away and I think if your producing a track to the best of your ability with what tricks you know at the time, then your on the right path.

Personally i think that the best sounding productions are those with a signature style eg: Re:Locate, Airbase, Thrillseekers etc.. If you can work on your own style and experiment withing the boundaries of your knowledge, then at the very least you will be producing with originality even if it doesnt quite sound pro.

Basically what I'm saying is that a boring track is still boring, even if its perfectly mastered. A creative track that keeps you interested, even if it is rough, will still be inspirational and a symbol that your improving as a musician and not just as an engineer. To me, that is much more important.

practise practise practise practise !

___________________
serpmusic.com

Patience/ Practise/ Do more is the key of success.

Im lack of these as I often do only just loops. But i will keep on trying no matter what.. U get much better for every single stuff you did. If were to say not good enuff, so be it. Let it aside, then come back again.. U might want to redo it, tweak it or throw away and start the new one. No fear... All of us are learning...

I hope I can finish at least one freaking listenable Trance to let all of u listen.

Cheers, let's work hard!

___________________
Lets !!!

Production Site
-=:::Currently in the stage of new tune:::=-

quote:

Originally posted by RIPassion Lots of people will say "if you don't think a track is going anywhere, just start over" etc. I think this holds true only after a certain amount of producing. At first, I think you need to just keep making a bunch of full tracks, no matter how crappy they are. People get upset when their first track isn't Cafe del Mar. Man, I'd for you guys to hear my first track :P (I laughed out loud last time I heard it... wtf was I thinking?!) But I got a lot out of it. And that's the point when you're starting - practice, practice, practice.

Can't agree more on this. I know people are that obssesed with quality of their "tracks". They are mixing and mastering their little loops for ages and never finish anything . Infact, they are doing this for so long now that some other basic skills are eluding them, such as building up and transitions, and so their tracks are sucking in the opposite direction now

A novice producer should certainly force him to finish things no matter how good/bad they sound.There is more to a song than just sounds.


Ontopic: Im pretty demanding on myself. Using all available headphones and stereos to chech my tracks, im rarely satisfied. I, however, rise ego a bit with mixing my tracks in a set among other signed material.
You do notice errors easier than just listening to a bunch of tracks in winamp, since the songs overlap.

___________________
Reconceal management

http://reconceal.com
https://soundcloud.com/reconceal
http://www.beatport.com/artist/reconceal/56292

For bookings please contact:: [email protected]

hhmmmm my standard is pretty pig eared to be honest

Seeing as ive done a few tracks like 4 or 5 im not really bothered about the quality but everyone i do the next is always alot better

I agree with the point that you should create your own style, like Thrillseekers, Rank 1, Tiesto etc I really want to do this but seeing as im still pretty basic producer i dont see this coming soon but Deep Voyage style will be hitting you soon