I can ARP the f@ck out of Vanguard. It's great for arps...but I don't like it's overall sound. Still, a cool synthie...it definately has its strenghts...and unique sound...I can recognize that synth in a symphonic gagglef@ck.

vanguard have it's own fuzzy sound,i don't like it..if you want fat sound then layering and playing same notes in two or more octaves is the key,and good eq of course
igloo,that sample is rich and fat,but still fuzzy and typical vanguard sound.

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wow, how did you do that?
no white noise at all.
when i eq vanguard on the highs i get high noise.

what freqs do u eq?

I am not using cubase.


thanks man
omer

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quote:

The updated version uses alias-free oscies so it sounds way better. Mine is the old one, so the high frequencies are crazy in the ears. I don't understand how he cannot get highs in Vanguard. That's the most ear piercing VSTi I've ever heard. I cannot wear my headphones with it when programming sounds. I can do that with every other synthie.

nah the alias free oscillators alias loads. just not as much as the aliasing one.

and drow, if you are making supersaws on vanguard why didnt you say?

basic principle of a supersaw:

multiple saw wave oscillators

low pass filter, low resonance.

modulate the oscillator pitch on the LFO positively on the first oscillator and negatively on the 2nd oscillator. keep the 3rd oscillator static since thats the sub oscillator and is going to play an octave below oscillator 1.

detune up real high.

chorus effect (you will have to use this outside of vanguard).

no reverb or at the very most only a tiny touch.

delay.

voila.

it wont sound like a JP supersaw owing to the fact it has a specific oscillator waveform for it and a feedback oscillator. but hey. you can get fat fuzz on vanguard easily.

its just like programming a basic string sound only with more detune and more saw waves. example coming...

EDIT: to get rid of the white noise type hiss just put a filter on it. set it to low pass and swing out the highs. resonance on zero. and lower the cutoff till te sibilance disappears. easy.

I know about the filter.
The problem is that all of my track comes out with really little highs and much lows.

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The Darkone - Falling Stars Part 1 (Original Mix) *NEW*

You know after reading this thread Drow, I'm beginning to think you've got something very wrong on your end. Maybe your copy of Vanguard or something else is messed up? Vanguard produces the highest and clearest of highs for me and it looks like it does the same as others have said. It does this out of the box, so I cannot imagine how your having trouble with hardly any highs. What version of Vanguard are you using? Flip it around and it will tell you. I believe version 1.12 is the latest.

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you are definitely doing something wrong.

this is my crack at a few supersawish sounds:

http://www.soundclick.us/fastkG/09/...dsupersaws2.mp3

all using a single instance of vanguard. all 3 are live takes with the first one being an overdub (please forgive the scrappy playing or if i didnt get the cygnus tune quite right.) all using fruity internal effects (i only use 2 any way, chorus to fuzz them all up a bit more and a fruity filter to cut out all of the fuzz on that low rumbling pad type sound. thats exactly the same patch as the lead thats playing on the top. only low pass filtered.)

other than that, these sounds are played raw with no extra post processing, no mastering and no levels adjustments. listening to it again the chorus delay time on the first sound is probably a touch too long. ill fix that.

all sounds built using the method i described above. NO reverb. LFO 1 and 2 modulating oscillator pitch 1 and 2 in different directions with the cutoff quite open and the LFO speed set fairly slow. all saws (the first patch is a mix of bi saws and saws). tune the 2nd saw oscillator and octave above the 1st to get a nice wide spread. leave the 3rd oscillator as is since its the sub oscillator anyway - you'll want that for the bottom end. single pole 6dB low pass filter. low resonance. adjust keytrix/vetrix to taste. adjust envelope to taste.

interesting point to note: even on the 4 pole low pass filter with the cutoff all the way down i still get mad fuzz. i have to drop the cutoffs on the envelope and LFO to start cutting that out. i do like a thin layer of hiss going along with the sound though cuz it gives the sound some air.

heck i should just make a trance supersaw bank just repeating different variations of these. if i could get 128 patches - all reasonably different would you buy it for say 5 dollars?

Last edited by Derivative on Apr-21-2005 at 07:21

you are right.
something is wrong with my vanguard.
and those supersaws are good.
I'm using version 1.04

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The Darkone - You Come With Power
The Darkone - Falling Stars Part 1 (Original Mix) *NEW*

try building one now using the method i described. keep it simple. get it right.

3 sawtooths. tune the 2nd oscillator up 12 semi tones (1 full octave)

now on the LFO set the LFO speed of oscillator 1 around 3 o clock. keep it fairly slow. modulate the tuning of oscillator 1 negatively (set the detune to -8) and open the LFO cutoff to around 2 or 3 o clock.

do the opposite on LFO 2. keep the LFO speed low again but this time modulate the tuning of oscillator 2 in the opposite direction (+8 on the detune knob) and open the LFO cutoff to taste. about 1 to 4 o clock.

bring the decay up on both envelopes fairly high. around 12 to 3 o clock. up the release to at least 12 o clock on both envelopes. increase the amp attack to just get rid of the click. about 9 o clock ish.

on the filter let it 6dB low pass. up the vetrix to around 2 o clock. keep the keytrix around 12. open the resonance very slightly. not too much.

now on the oscillator. set the fatness up pretty high. around 3 o clock.

add some delay.

you have a basic vanguard supersaw type lead. it wont sound like a JP but it has that trance sound.

to fatten it up even more. stack multiple vanguards using the same patch on top of each other. make sure the detune and spread of each one is slightly different. this is simulate unison mode on some synths because vanguard doesnt have unison.

watch your CPU load because with the high release and multiple instances you can crash your PC pretty hard doing this.

quote:

I can ARP the f@ck out of Vanguard. It's great for arps...but I don't like it's overall sound. Still, a cool synthie...it definately has its strenghts...and unique sound...I can recognize that synth in a symphonic gagglef@ck.

i agree. i dont like vanguard's sound either. its metallic and its too gritty for my liking (although it does some AWESOME psychedellic squelches). and yea you can recognise it a mile off. but on the flip side its by far the most intuitive and easy to program synth ive ever used. probably one of the best synth for starting out and learning subtractive synthesis on.

Ok I now have the newest version...
Still no highs
maybe its my soundcard?
It's an onboard one.

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My tracks:
The Darkone - You Come With Power
The Darkone - Falling Stars Part 1 (Original Mix) *NEW*

It does sound trancy but still NO HIGHS

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My tracks:
The Darkone - You Come With Power
The Darkone - Falling Stars Part 1 (Original Mix) *NEW*

uhhh. post a sound sample.