no offense taken . but, do me this favor, go to any islamic arabic country that is neighboring to me (im in israel) and look at the women there, they are covered up except for the eyes, are not allowed to speak, are worth half as much as a man, and are allowed to make very little or no decisions at all. that doesnt sound like too much respect for me...

could you please post the arabic text, so that i could print it out and have an arabic neighbor or friend translate it for me?

if i had to dress like this i wouldnt feel respected:
(pic i took in jerusalem)

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Last edited by yarzan on May-27-2005 at 11:23

quote:

Originally posted by yarzan no offense taken .

It's all good dude. I try to give ppl the benefit of the doubt before jumping to conclusions.

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Originally posted by yarzan but, do me this favor, go to any islamic arabic country that is neighboring to me (im in israel) and look at the women there, they are covered up except for the eyes, are not allowed to speak, are worth half as much as a man, and are allowed to make very little or no decisions at all. that doesnt sound like too much respect for me...

Unfortunately that is the case in some areas in the Arab world, which is very sad. And this unfortunate scenario is usually found in areas where there are very corrupt regimes and (in certain countries), where the nutty fundamentalist have influence on the Goverment (so in some places, like Saudi Arabia, women are required by law to dress up like that, which is pretty fucked up IMO). Another factor to is lack of education in certain parts too. Yeah, it really sucks.

quote:

Originally posted by yarzan could you please post the arabic text, so that i could print it out and have an arabic neighbor or friend translate it for me?

Just do a google search for it. It should be hard to find. There's loads of sites with the Quran in Arabic.

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"The Greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge." -Stephen Hawking
"First they came for the communists, and I did not speak out— because I was not a communist;
Then they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out— because I was not a socialist;
Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out— because I was not a trade unionist;
Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out— because I was not a Jew;
Then they came for me— and there was no one left to speak out for me." -Martin Niemöller

yay we agree on something . id like to post that the Jewish religion is going the same way, much as Islam did. they take some things in their hoyl scriptures to the extreme, while completly ignoring others. the Rabbis, as with lots of the Muslim leaders, have built up such a blincing wall, its sick how far away from the original both religions have gotten.

if you got AIM, hit me up my sn is yarxan

or for msn its [email protected]

id love to continue this in real time.

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quote:

Originally posted by yarzan yay we agree on something . id like to post that the Jewish religion is going the same way, much as Islam did. they take some things in their hoyl scriptures to the extreme, while completly ignoring others. the Rabbis, as with lots of the Muslim leaders, have built up such a blincing wall, its sick how far away from the original both religions have gotten. if you got AIM, hit me up my sn is yarxan or for msn its [email protected] id love to continue this in real time.

That would be pretty cool but its like 6:32 am here in Texas and I really need to get some sleep and then go job hunting (yeah, I know, I am soooo responsible and disciplined ). But if you want to discuss something later my AIM is i82z. Peace.

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"The Greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge." -Stephen Hawking
"First they came for the communists, and I did not speak out— because I was not a communist;
Then they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out— because I was not a socialist;
Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out— because I was not a trade unionist;
Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out— because I was not a Jew;
Then they came for me— and there was no one left to speak out for me." -Martin Niemöller

quote:

Originally posted by yarzan no offense taken . but, do me this favor, go to any islamic arabic country that is neighboring to me (im in israel) and look at the women there, they are covered up except for the eyes, are not allowed to speak, are worth half as much as a man, and are allowed to make very little or no decisions at all. that doesnt sound like too much respect for me... could you please post the arabic text, so that i could print it out and have an arabic neighbor or friend translate it for me? if i had to dress like this i wouldnt feel respected: (pic i took in jerusalem)

Ok....Lebanon...women...Lebanese women...

(please everybody has to find pictures of Lebanese women and post them here!!)

Anyway, you have just proved yourself a very ignorant little boy with that last post. Maybe under the Taliban in Afghanistan women had to dress like that but they were a religious theocracy. If anyone dresses like that in Palestine, Lebanon, Syria or Jordan its not cos they have to. You think Syria is gonna make people dress like that?! And you think Fatah would dress their woment up like that?! And all those women in bikinis on the beach in Beirut...

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Originally posted by George Smiley Ok....Lebanon...women...Lebanese women... (please everybody has to find pictures of Lebanese women and post them here!!) Anyway, you have just proved yourself a very ignorant little boy with that last post. Maybe under the Taliban in Afghanistan women had to dress like that but they were a religious theocracy. If anyone dresses like that in Palestine, Lebanon, Syria or Jordan its not cos they have to. You think Syria is gonna make people dress like that?! And you think Fatah would dress their woment up like that?! And all those women in bikinis on the beach in Beirut...

i dont know if a country would make their women dress like that, thats not the point here. were discussing the kuran and what it contains. kthxbye.

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Originally posted by yarzan i dont know if a country would make their women dress like that, thats not the point here. were discussing the kuran and what it contains. kthxbye.

Ok then Mr-twisty-wordy...

You said women in the countries bordering Israel (Lebanon(!), Syria, Palestine, Syria) all the women are covered up apart from their eyes

quote:

go to any islamic arabic country that is neighboring to me (im in israel) and look at the women there, they are covered up except for the eyes

Now I dont doubt some women in these countries do dress like that but to say they all dress like that is stupid. In Afghanistan it was the culture, in Syria they killed most of the Islamists, Jordan is fairly modern (for Middle East standards) in Palestine you have the PLO who hate the Islamists and in Lebanon you have (imo) the nearest to a western country after Israel and Turkey.

Saudi Arabia is terrible, possibly the worst in the Muslim world for human rights. And I agree whole heartedly they need pressure being put on them. But while the United States reserves its harshest criticisms for Damascus and Terhan, it praises Saudi Arabia and Egypt for the progress they are making towards democracy!!


Anyway, I'm sure you didn't intend to get into a debate about America so my point was this...wearing a burka is what fundamentalists do, your implication that all women were forced to wear burkas was that in Lebanon (again, exclamation mark!), Syria, Jordan and Palestine were full of Islamic fundamentalists which is kakka...

i did not mean to say that all women are, i look back at my posts and see that it came out that way, my bad, i was wrong. i meant that some are, therefore degrading them, etc etc, ive said all of it before lol. but i wont go back and edit them, otherwise someone else reading this might get confused. also, going slightly OT here, the PLO sees itself as muslim extremist and every saturday you can turn on the TV to their channel and watch them preach about how the blood of "infidels" (jews and christians to us) should run through the street....coinkidink, i dont THINK so.

mr-twisty-wordy, i like that . sounds like an 80s cartoon show villain

"Oh noes its mister-twisty-wordy, RUN!"

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Are you sure you dont mean Hamas, not the PLO?

Fatah and Hamas hate each other (and ideological differences meant the PFLP and DFLP could not stay allied to Hamas in opposition to the Oslo Accords)

The PLO groups are Marxists revolutionaries and as such are secular. Fatah and Hamas have fought pitched battles on numerous occasions and during the Intifada (1st) PLO groups would go round beating up clerics, disrupting prayers and hanging communist banners over mosques

Also, Fatah contains many Christians and the PFLP was set up by a Christian (they also say Jesus was the "first Palestinian") so you'll have to forgive me if I take what you just said about them with a pinch of salt

(Unless you meant Hamas?)

Also, you can see women wearing Burkas in the UK...

These muslims are shit. They will shit on the cross. And then the first time someone degrades their holy book that they dont even abide by the cry Jihad.

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quote:

Originally posted by George Smiley Are you sure you dont mean Hamas, not the PLO? Fatah and Hamas hate each other (and ideological differences meant the PFLP and DFLP could not stay allied to Hamas in opposition to the Oslo Accords) The PLO groups are Marxists revolutionaries and as such are secular. Fatah and Hamas have fought pitched battles on numerous occasions and during the Intifada (1st) PLO groups would go round beating up clerics, disrupting prayers and hanging communist banners over mosques Also, Fatah contains many Christians and the PFLP was set up by a Christian (they also say Jesus was the "first Palestinian") so you'll have to forgive me if I take what you just said about them with a pinch of salt (Unless you meant Hamas?)

once again, you got me, i meant hamas. you're too keen lol

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