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Originally posted by Lebezniatnikov Whoa, whoa. Let me blow your mind here. Giuliani was in London during the new "British 9-11". He was in New York during the American 9-11.... Coincidence?

Nothing to see here..Move along..there is nothing to see here.

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Originally posted by Frase conspiracy theories annoy me.

Wait until things really hit the fan and then you'll puke your guts out after believing all the "conspiracy theories" that annoyed you.

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Originally posted by MisterOpus1 So again I ask, what exactly has this Administration done that has been truly effective in fighting off global terrorism?

WASHINGTON: The US government yesterday dramatically raised its official 2004 estimate of international terror attacks to 3192 from about 650 after adopting a broader definition of terrorism aimed at presenting a clearer picture of the worldwide phenomenon....
...The five-fold increase in the estimate of 2004 terror incidents results from the introduction of a new definition of terrorism that encompasses both international and domestic attacks and includes all injuries and property damages.
In late April, the Bush administration reported that 651 incidents of international terrorism had resulted in 1,907 deaths, 6704 injuries and 710 kidnappings in 2004. The data was based on a narrower definition that excluded indigenous attacks and included only those injuries that were more than superficial and damages of over $US10,000 ($NZ14,967.81).
US redefines terrorism, and incidents skyrocket

I am not about downplaying events in Iraq but by cooking the numbers it makes the US seem as if they can't control the situation. Had this new definition been used from the onset then there would be a small change. But since it has been redefined then things are different and looking for the worse.

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Originally posted by Frase conspiracy theories annoy me.

Yeah, critical thinking is just too laborious for so many people these days.

Alternative and conflicting viewpoints can be too much for some simple minds to handle.

i wouldnt say too much for simple minds, its just people decide to make out their own version of events.

Anyway regarding yesterdays attrocity, theres many flawed arguments ive heard that so called governments are behind all this

If they actually thought about the events & used their brain they'd realise from what happened, they actually might be terrorists

shocka marocka

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frase.org.uk - music & stuff
myspace

how come you deleted your post ogvh?

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frase.org.uk - music & stuff
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Originally posted by Frase i wouldnt say too much for simple minds, its just people decide to make out their own version of events. Anyway regarding yesterdays attrocity, theres many flawed arguments ive heard that so called governments are behind all this If they actually thought about the events & used their brain they'd realise from what happened, they actually might be terrorists shocka marocka

My first thought when I heard - just on a personal basis, when I heard there had been this attack and I saw the futures this morning, which were really in the tank, I thought, 'Hmmm, time to buy.'
Hume's "first thought" on hearing of London attacks: It's "time to buy" futures

You get your news from people like that idiot.

All warfare is based on deception
Sun Tzu

In war, truth is the first casualty
Aeschylus

The more you read and learn, the less your adversary will know
Sun Tzu

Knowledge makes a man unfit to be a slave
Frederick Douglass

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Originally posted by Frase i wouldnt say too much for simple minds, its just people decide to make out their own version of events. Anyway regarding yesterdays attrocity, theres many flawed arguments ive heard that so called governments are behind all this If they actually thought about the events & used their brain they'd realise from what happened, they actually might be terrorists shocka marocka

Do you mean like how Dubya and Cheney are still repeating the lies that have been disproven a good while ago?

No, I'm sure they WERE committed by terrorists. Whether or not they were aided and/or abetted is what remains as the mystery.

With all of the secrecy and deception, it's hard to take anything at face value these days.

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Originally posted by Trancer-X Do you mean like how Dubya and Cheney are still repeating the lies that have been disproven a good while ago? No, I'm sure they WERE committed by terrorists. Whether or not they were aided and/or abetted is what remains as the mystery. With all of the secrecy and deception, it's hard to take anything at face value these days.

Well id like to jus politely remind we dont have Dubya on our government, whilst we're allies with them we certainly have a bit more in the way of brain power.

I can understand the whole secrecy & decpetion point but there were many things about this attack which make it too much of an amateur job if you get me? Something went wrong in the proposed plan of attack hence why the bus blew up.

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The three bombs went off nearly simultaneously at about 8:50 a.m. Thursday, said Deputy Assistant Commissioner Brian Paddick said, revising earlier accounts that they occurred within a 26-minute span. An explosion tore through a double-decker bus nearly an hour later.
New information about the timing of the explosions also suggested they were detonated with synchronized timers rather than by suicide bombers, although officials said nothing had been ruled out.
Police: London Blasts Were Seconds Apart

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Suspected al Qaeda militants behind the London bombings may well have come from a previously unknown local cell and yet had access to military explosives, European security officials familiar with the probe said.
"The explosives appear to be of military origin, which is very worrying," said Christophe Chaboud, head of the French Anti-Terrorism Coordination Unit and one of five top officials sent by Paris to London immediately after Thursday's attacks.
London bombs suggest local but well-equipped cell

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Originally posted by Frase Well id like to jus politely remind we dont have Dubya on our government, whilst we're allies with them we certainly have a bit more in the way of brain power.

Yeah, but Blair essentially serves the same people as Dubya does.

Anyway, even with all that extra brainpower, you guys are turning into a surveillance state even faster than we are!


http://www.csmonitor.com/2004/0206/p07s02-woeu.html

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/politics/3568468.stm

http://www.salaam.co.uk/themeofthem...dex.php?l=54%82

POWER: Today we were running an exercise for a company - bear in mind now that I'm in the private sector - and we sat everybody down in the city - 1000 people involved in the whole organization - with the crisis team. And the most peculiar thing was it was we based on a scenario of simultaneous attacks on a underground and mainline station. So we had to suddenly switch an exercise from fictional to real. And one of the first things is, get that bureau number, when you have a list of people missing, tell them. And it took a long time -
INTERVIEWER: Just to get this right, you were actually working today on an exercise that envisioned virtually this scenario?
POWER: Almost precisely. I was up to 2 oclock this morning, because it's our job, my own company. Visor Consultants, we specialize in helping people to get their crisis management response, how you jump from slow time thinking to quick time doing. And we chose a scenario with no assistance, which is based on a terrorist attack because they've been close to a property occupied by Jewish businessmen there in the city, and there are more American banks in this city than there are in the whole of New York - a logical thing to do.
INTERVIEWER: How extraordinary today must feel for you as it unfolds. You mentioned a few moments ago there our experience with Irish Republican terrorism. And of course it was very different wasn't it because however perverted their behavior, the IRA believed itself to have some sort of code of honour, and tended to issue some kind of warnings, of course they often came too late to do any good.
London Underground Bombing 'Exercises' Took Place at Same Time as Real Attack

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Originally posted by ogvh5150 POWER: Today we were running an exercise for a company - bear in mind now that I'm in the private sector - and we sat everybody down in the city - 1000 people involved in the whole organization - with the crisis team. And the most peculiar thing was it was we based on a scenario of simultaneous attacks on a underground and mainline station. So we had to suddenly switch an exercise from fictional to real. And one of the first things is, get that bureau number, when you have a list of people missing, tell them. And it took a long time - INTERVIEWER: Just to get this right, you were actually working today on an exercise that envisioned virtually this scenario? POWER: Almost precisely. I was up to 2 oclock this morning, because it's our job, my own company. Visor Consultants, we specialize in helping people to get their crisis management response, how you jump from slow time thinking to quick time doing. And we chose a scenario with no assistance, which is based on a terrorist attack because they've been close to a property occupied by Jewish businessmen there in the city, and there are more American banks in this city than there are in the whole of New York - a logical thing to do. INTERVIEWER: How extraordinary today must feel for you as it unfolds. You mentioned a few moments ago there our experience with Irish Republican terrorism. And of course it was very different wasn't it because however perverted their behavior, the IRA believed itself to have some sort of code of honour, and tended to issue some kind of warnings, of course they often came too late to do any good. London Underground Bombing 'Exercises' Took Place at Same Time as Real Attack

If that's true, then it instantly brings something else to mind...

http://www.libertyforum.org/showfla...r=293208438&t=0