quote:

Originally posted by MarkT that's my only problem with this... no stats to back it up, but I'd have to guess that 'poor' people are less likely to pay someone to do their taxes who might alert them to this deduction? whatever...it's a very good initiative, but it would have been nice if the gov't just subsidized the metropass to make it easier for Metropass buyers. from the TTC standpoint, it doesn't matter...either the gov't pays them the $$$ for each one they sell, or the buyer gets the credit after the fact. from a consumer standpoint, you'd rather receive the rebate now and let the TTC sort out getting their money from the gov't...from the TTC standpoint, they're probably quite happy at the tax credit route.

Hey Mark...

I think you make REALLY great points in your post.

The way I see this, it's meant to increase ridership by getting people who presently drive downtown, to leave their cars at subway stations and take the TTC and not to simply reduce the cost of monthly passes.

The benefits to the City and the TTC would be enormous both in terms of green house gas emissions and additonal revenue to the TTC.

At some point, I hope the program will be inhanced to cover the issues you raise.

I suppose for me, I am just glad to see new ideas, innovation, and at least have something done instead of all the talk we have had from governments in the past.

Let's not be "idea assasins"....I am always in favour of trying something new....does not matter what side of the political spectrum it comes from...

Government inaction and whining are my pet peeves!!!

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Originally posted by Orko In the end the administration costs would be the same

I beg to differ. The costs of a new TTC subsidy would create new paperwork and new administrative positions, while a change to the tax code does not. (you might have to write in one extra figure on your tax form, and proof of purchase of your metropasses)

___________________
"It's mercifully over. But a new phenomenon has taken hold. I recognize it: feelings. Now that they're back, even overcompensating, I never want to lose them again. Bitterness, anger, jealousy, sadness: They all make me happy."

quote:

Originally posted by AwakenedAddict lol, if you can't fork over $100 at the beginning of the month, you've got some serious fiscal issues. Like paying the rent, or eating. One reason poor people stay poor is that they do stupid things like buying tokens everyday, instead of a metropass. Help yourself first!

that's kinda the point though ... since rent and metropass are due at the same time, it can really strain that paycheque. Poor people are poor because they have shitty jobs, its not really about spending habits.

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Originally posted by Orko This is exactly what I was thinking. In the end the administration costs would be the same, because either way they have to file paper work telling the Fed how many passes they sold that month. I think collectively giving the money back instantly would save more people time and money. I'm sure it will be a simple rebate but its just one less thing to worry about at tax time. PLUS I am guessing you would have to save all your TTC passes for the year? That would be very annoying.

that last point is interesting.

anyone know the reporting guidelines yet from CCRA? Do people need to attach receipts (like for RRSP deductions, medical expenses) or is it being done on a declaration basis (like rent claims)?

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Originally posted by MarkT that last point is interesting. anyone know the reporting guidelines yet from CCRA? Do people need to attach receipts (like for RRSP deductions, medical expenses) or is it being done on a declaration basis (like rent claims)?

With rent you have to be able to prove your rent in case of an audit. I don't think it would be too much of a burden for the ttc to issue a receipt when you purchase a metro pass.

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Originally posted by TO guy that's kinda the point though ... since rent and metropass are due at the same time, it can really strain that paycheque. Poor people are poor because they have shitty jobs, its not really about spending habits.

you really would be surprised. Yes poor people are poor because they have bad jobs. But take a ride on the bus any day and you will see countless people using tickets/tokens, yet they have a new cellphone and new clothes etc. Take a walk in a ghetto sometime, a lot of people look fly with their gear, but that's all they have.. they are behind on the rent and behind on their bills. Spending habits are a BIG part of the equation.

___________________
"It's mercifully over. But a new phenomenon has taken hold. I recognize it: feelings. Now that they're back, even overcompensating, I never want to lose them again. Bitterness, anger, jealousy, sadness: They all make me happy."

quote:

Originally posted by AwakenedAddict you really would be surprised. Yes poor people are poor because they have bad jobs. But take a ride on the bus any day and you will see countless people using tickets/tokens, yet they have a new cellphone and new clothes etc. Take a walk in a ghetto sometime, a lot of people look fly with their gear, but that's all they have.. they are behind on the rent and behind on their bills. Spending habits are a BIG part of the equation.

I really don't see how a hundred dollar pair of jeans equates to a fifty thousand dollar income differential.

Full time (10 trips/week) = $21 (buying tokens)

Metro pass after rebate: $99.75 -15.5% = $84.28 / 4 = $21.07


People usually do not buy a metro pass because they don't take enough transit on the weekends to justify the extra cost. If they gave the rebate instantly, it becomes a very close and more people would probably start buying the passes

I now believe the true reason they are doing this as a tax credit, is for all the people that signed contracts for their monthly TTC passes. As the adverts promise, the price is garunteed for 12 months. If that is infact the case, then their prices would stay the same, and the people who buy from month to month would pay a lower price. The contract holders would surely be upset.

quote:

Originally posted by Orko I now believe the true reason they are doing this as a tax credit, is for all the people that signed contracts for their monthly TTC passes. As the adverts promise, the price is garunteed for 12 months. If that is infact the case, then their prices would stay the same, and the people who buy from month to month would pay a lower price. The contract holders would surely be upset.

perhaps ... although they could just issue a refund.

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Originally posted by Orko People usually do not buy a metro pass because they don't take enough transit on the weekends to justify the extra cost.

Yeh, you're right.. all of us metropassholders just go driving around on the weekend with the cars we don't have.

___________________
"It's mercifully over. But a new phenomenon has taken hold. I recognize it: feelings. Now that they're back, even overcompensating, I never want to lose them again. Bitterness, anger, jealousy, sadness: They all make me happy."

quote:

Originally posted by TO guy I really don't see how a hundred dollar pair of jeans equates to a fifty thousand dollar income differential.

um.. want to clarify that a little bit?

___________________
"It's mercifully over. But a new phenomenon has taken hold. I recognize it: feelings. Now that they're back, even overcompensating, I never want to lose them again. Bitterness, anger, jealousy, sadness: They all make me happy."

quote:

Originally posted by AwakenedAddict um.. want to clarify that a little bit?

if they guys all decked out in the ghetto had a job that paid substantially more than whatever they have now, I think that would be a bigger factor in their wealth than their spending habits.