quote:

If they're such a secret society why would we be able to go to their lodge??

You could possibly drive or walk by but not enter as your not a member. There are plenty of lodges in Ontario alone FYI. I am sure some other board members around here know of their locations and will point them out.

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Novus Ordo Seclorum = New Order Of The Ages = A secret society that seeks to control the whole world. How could I NOT have seen this before???? The connections are undeniable.

Your replys show that you do not know much about secret societys, let me guess you think mafia is BS also?

If you need to rely on wikipedia to make yourself feel better be my guest though.

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Originally posted by solgrabber You could possibly drive or walk by but not enter as your not a member. There are plenty of lodges in Ontario alone FYI. I am sure some other board members around here know of their locations and will point them out.

So how does one distinguish a Freemason lodge from anyother lodge?

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Originally posted by solgrabber Your replys show that you do not know much about secret societys, let me guess you think mafia is BS also?

Here's the difference though: There's proof that the Mafia exists: like for example arrests, convictions, evidence of the Mafia family dealings (phonecalls, documents, etc etc). There's no solid proof of these secret societies at all. They're so secret, and work so effectively, that try as they might, neither the FBI or any govenment agency set up to protect the people from such societies can ever even come close to catching one of the members. Don't you find that just a little unrealistic?

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Originally posted by solgrabber If you need to rely on wikipedia to make yourself feel better be my guest though.

Oh silly me, researching the topic and posting a reputable, unbiased source instead of just relying on what some guy told me.

___________________
I'm the trouble starter, fuckin' instigator.
I'm the fear-addicted, danger illustrated.

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Originally posted by solgrabber Sorry man you need to research a bit more, New World Order is a known fact. Take a look below at the wording on the American one dollar bill underneath the all seeing eye on the left hand side. Novus Ordo Seclorum = New Order Of The Ages = New World Order

If I may interject. If you recall from gr10 CDN history class, Hundreds of years ago, the Western Hemisphere was called the New World, and the Easter Hemisphere was called the Old World.

So the tinfoild hat works here by misinterpretting it as 'new order of the world' instead of 'order of the new world'. Far less dramatic than the former.

There's tons of ways to interpret a lot of things on dollar bills and words marked in history. Use any interpretation you want, it's fun to debate.

Now I'll get back to my $20 bill and fold it into the twin towers burning.

___________________

Short time TA, Long time Guver, Good time giver.

quote:

Originally posted by Cosmic Fur Conspiracy theorists, let's suppose you guys are right about this whole 9/11 thing. Now answer me this: "Now what?"

With that knowledge we could deduce the following:

- Iraq is a fraud, and the war there with its 'links to 9/11 - Al queda" would end. Completely - (fight the real war in the middle east)
- terrorism as we know it would be a lie
- we would stop looking for Bin Laden in Afghanistan and start looking for him at the Bush Ranch.
-Bush is a murderer or took part in a conspriracy which resulted in the death of innocent americans
- every living human who lost someone in 9/11 could form the largest class action lawsuit and sue the government of america
- the republican party as it operates now, would lose its support, almost all of it.
- budgets would not be spent on fake solutions to a fake terrorist threats, and would be spent on medicare, social services, tax breaks....
- Muslims around the world would not be considered terrorists.

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Originally posted by 7-4-7 - Iraq is a fraud, and the war there with its 'links to 9/11 - Al queda" would end. Completely - (fight the real war in the middle east)

Iraq is already a fraud - Bush went in there under the premise that Saddam had WMDs. He later admitted that there never were any WMDs and that they knew this when lying to the American public, and still no one in America gave a shit. People still support the war in Iraq, and the US troops are still there even though technically they have no reason to be there since the govt itself admitted that there is no WMDs in Iraq. So, Bush lied about WMDs, thousands of soldiers died for no reason, the public found out, and no one gave a shit. Now, with 9/11 we have: Bush lied, thousands of people died for no reason, care to guess how many people will give a fuck about this truth?

The problem with America lies in the public itself.

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Originally posted by 7-4-7 - terrorism as we know it would be a lie

Incorrect. Terrorism is very real and exists outside of US, and has existed for many years before 9/11.

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Originally posted by 7-4-7 - we would stop looking for Bin Laden in Afghanistan and start looking for him at the Bush Ranch.

Al-Quada is also a very real terrorist organization. Unless you deny the existence of that as well. So while maybe we wouldn't be looking for Bin Laden, there are still real high-profile terrorists out there.

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Originally posted by 7-4-7 -Bush is a murderer or took part in a conspriracy which resulted in the death of innocent americans

See what I said about Iraq. People already know this, and don't give a shit. Yay, patriotism.

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Originally posted by 7-4-7 - every living human who lost someone in 9/11 could form the largest class action lawsuit and sue the government of america

No, they can't. They'll never have sufficient proof. Just because a lot of people believe the government did it, doesn't make it any truer in the eyes of a judge. If there was proof that would stand up in court, a lawsuit would already be filed.

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Originally posted by 7-4-7 - the republican party as it operates now, would lose its support, almost all of it.

You're underestimating the stupidity and ignorance of middle America.

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Originally posted by 7-4-7 - budgets would not be spent on fake solutions to a fake terrorist threats, and would be spent on medicare, social services, tax breaks....

Aahahahahha. Now you're just being naive.

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Originally posted by 7-4-7 - Muslims around the world would not be considered terrorists.

Let's not forget 9/11 was not the only terrorist act carried out by Muslim extremists. Furthermore, opinion is a fickle thing - even if you get a lot of people convinced that Muslims had nothing to do with 9/11, the public's opinion of Muslims would still be negative. For proof, see the fight against racism - how logn has that been going on for?

___________________
I'm the trouble starter, fuckin' instigator.
I'm the fear-addicted, danger illustrated.

you asked "now what?" my response was in the context of "if everything were proved true"

as you say opinion is a fickle things and so is a beleif system, I actually beleive this all to be true, all of it.

as for picking apart my thoughts...

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No, they can't. They'll never have sufficient proof. Just because a lot of people believe the government did it, doesn't make it any truer in the eyes of a judge. If there was proof that would stand up in court, a lawsuit would already be filed.

- there would be sufficiant proof for a class action suit...that is the whole point of this hypothtical....oh so bcause no one has done it it can't be true...because the firemen who watched the bombs blowup with their own eyes, that ultimatley leveled the two main towers...would't have case....or teh government wont allow it.

differances of opinion on "terrorism"

- Terrorism has been inexistence for centuries, terrorist do not call themselves terrorists, they see the themselves as protectors of something, a beleif, an ethnicity, somthing - it is those withwhom they attack that call them terrorist so as to incite violence to protect.

you say "Incorrect. Terrorism is very real and exists outside of US, and has existed for many years before 9/11."

I wasnt aware that muslims were the only one capable of terrorism. I beleive that AMerica's presence in Iraq is a form of terrorism, as is isreals occupation...this term is redundant, bullshit and is a game of finger pointing. my claim was terrorism as we know it (now) "post 9/11" is a lie..post 9/11, if 9/11 is a lie, and a creation of the american government, then terrorism post 9/11 is a lie.... in this hypotehical conversation, america becomes a terrorist organization

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Let's not forget 9/11 was not the only terrorist act carried out by Muslim extremists.

- what if you dont believe that it was carried out by Muslims, if you dont beleive the 9/11 story....are you referring to the COLE bombings, suicide bombings? violence against america is not new fad, this is 9/11 we are speaking of, keep it in that context, 9/11 is about alot more than hating america...9/11 is about a plan. The COLE bombings for example could have been muslims, could have been alot of things...9/11 is about something much bigger...iraq, oil, power, hatred, poltical positioning, alliances...future rationalization.

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You're underestimating the stupidity and ignorance of middle America.

ignorance i agree, if it became dogma that the government actually created 9/11 ignorance would be irrelevant, people would now see the current republican leadership as a detriment to ones personal safety in america. that may be the only thing that would change minds.

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Al-Quada is also a very real terrorist organization. Unless you deny the existence of that as well. So while maybe we wouldn't be looking for Bin Laden, there are still real high-profile terrorists out there.

funny where you seem to draw the line, Bin laden may not exist anymore as a threat....why? because they havent found him? and the entire world is looking...they aren't finding him because they arent looking...fuck he was at an american base weeks before 9/11...and he was a "threat" then...Why didnt they grab him then? they treated him, more than they dont for their own people in the states....but we are to beleive that al-quada exists, sure if that is what you want to call peolpe who are muslim, who hate american policy....who speak openly against them...i love it...saddam hussien was a dictator, he was a tyrant; yes I agree.... the moment he spoke out against america and supported violence against america he all of a sudden had 'links' to al-queda. These are all lies.

quote:

Originally posted by Cosmic Fur "Now what?"

VIVA LA REVOLUCION!!!!

This is the problem of arguing with conspiracy theorists - they never run out of more theories to back up their other theories. I can see that debating this any further will bring in conspiracies from the mid 1500s, and trying to debunk every one of them is utterly pointless because as long as at least one of them is not proven to be false, that automatically makes all the rest of them true.

___________________
I'm the trouble starter, fuckin' instigator.
I'm the fear-addicted, danger illustrated.

quote:

Originally posted by Cosmic Fur This is the problem of arguing with conspiracy theorists - they never run out of more theories to back up their other theories. I can see that debating this any further will bring in conspiracies from the mid 1500s, and trying to debunk every one of them is utterly pointless because as long as at least one of them is not proven to be false, that automatically makes all the rest of them true.

exactly. so lets just take up arms and kill things

wow...Thats some intense discussion on this thread..

This is what reading Da Vinci Code and Angels of Demons has done to you all...

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Now I'll get back to my $20 bill and fold it into the twin towers burning.

Glad you brought that up, why not try folding up the $1, $5, $50 and $100 the exact same way?

The odds of the pictures depicting the towers burning to the ground using the exact same fold over all the different notes is 0%. They were placed there by someone as a warning.

For those denying the existance of secret society's read through the many ebooks in the link below and start getting informed. The reason you only find BS references about them on wikipedia is because they are secret society's and do not want their presence easily found by the general public.

http://www.nwowatcher.com/ebooks/

quote:

Iraq is already a fraud - Bush went in there under the premise that Saddam had WMDs. He later admitted that there never were any WMDs and that they knew this when lying to the American public, and still no one in America gave a shit. People still support the war in Iraq, and the US troops are still there even though technically they have no reason to be there since the govt itself admitted that there is no WMDs in Iraq. So, Bush lied about WMDs, thousands of soldiers died for no reason, the public found out, and no one gave a shit. Now, with 9/11 we have: Bush lied, thousands of people died for no reason, care to guess how many people will give a fuck about this truth?

People still support the war in Iraq because they dont know the real story behind it. Most of them still believe Iraq had a hand in 9/11, this was what they used to initially get things going with Iraq and their false WMD's.



To also claim no one cares is ignorant Cosmic, people do care thats why 9/11 is the single most important event in our lifetime. It will continue to be brought up because it was wrong and this Sept 11 2006 like I have mentioned before will be huge. Look at what Mexico did recently with their protest to the rigged elections....thats 1.1 million people BTW.