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Originally posted by dj_kane yea although trance now isnt like it used to be, you have to move with the times. genres will progress forever and so will trance. nothing you can do apart from move with it. if you make tracks like years ago nobody wants to play them.

I agree and disagree.

Agree because remaining in the past and trying to make tracks exactly like they were in the past is a mistake. Possible example is the lack of innovation on epic trance since 1999 - many producers just try to make it as Gouryella as possible.

Disagree because "moving with the times" implicates doing what suits your time, producing tracks in the latest fad, moving with the bandwagon. See the amount of current shit minimal and "electro-house" records as example. Also, you shouldn't care in the slightest about what dj's could play your music - making tracks so they can fit perfectly the style of popular dj's has been quite another plague. Making tracks that at the time seemed nobody could possibly be insane enough to play is what pushed EDM forward.

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Originally posted by paranoik0 I agree and disagree. Agree because remaining in the past and trying to make tracks exactly like they were in the past is a mistake. Possible example is the lack of innovation on epic trance since 1999 - many producers just try to make it as Gouryella as possible. Disagree because "moving with the times" implicates doing what suits your time, producing tracks in the latest fad, moving with the bandwagon. See the amount of current shit minimal and "electro-house" records as example. Also, you shouldn't care in the slightest about what dj's could play your music - making tracks so they can fit perfectly the style of popular dj's has been quite another plague. Making tracks that at the time seemed nobody could possibly be insane enough to play is what pushed EDM forward.

i agree on your second paragraph. im always the one that says ill never switch genre just because its the 'in' music. im trance until the end. i make music based on what i feel and like to put my own style in. but to get recognition in the market or even by amatuers you need to be producing something that has similarities to the music today. theres tracks in the music promotion forum that are excellent and very original but people dont look at them due to this. unfortuneatly this is why the 'good' trance has slipped away.

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newer trance doesn't know the meaning of subtlety.

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Originally posted by MrJiveBoJingles I know, but sometimes it seems like that when trance adopted the "huge breakdown / intense lead / standout melody" formula, it lost a lot of what made it "trance," at least for me. Songs that have really well-defined "centerpieces" (long "breakdowns" in the newer trance) generally do not put me in what I would call a "trance," which I think of as a more fluid state where terms like "beginning / climax / end" lose importance; in the newer stuff, the entire focus is often to hurry up and get to the huge blow-out where everyone can wave their hands and so on.

That's pretty much what, over the last couple years, Ishkur has been saying/preaching/jamming down everybody's throats.

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Don't get me wrong, I like some of the new stuff quite a bit, and there are even some tracks by big names that sort of echo the "old" form that I prefer ("Sunburn" by AvB is one of those); I am just wondering how well the "trance" label fits much of the new stuff.

Sunburn got quite a bit of shit when it was released if I remember right.. but now that you mention it, looking back it doesn't seem really that bad.

I think if we take the stuff with longer breakdowns or less energy out of the mind frame of dance clubs and big festivals for dancing, then they might work alone as compositions. Just a thought. I'm of the thinking that this music isn't all strictly dance music, but compositional music and some producers are trying to make compositions that stand alone by themselves rather than full on, peak time dance music. You don't have to agree, but it's the way I view things with these kinds of discussions. We always think "this does" or "doesn't" work on the dance floor, rather than what works by itself as a good composition with a nice beat. Sure there's crap out there, but there's also some fairly good compositions that aren't just dance floor stormers. This stuff can work in lounges, in bars, or in CGI videos or film soundtracks or such. It can also be used in concept albums/mixes. And i'm sure it already is...my goal with my mixing at home (when I do mix) is to find a way to tell a story, create a journey or base it on a concept, rather than just being in the mind frame of people dancing in a sweaty club to it. Sure that's great, but is this music strictly for that? I don't think so...

Last edited by Spirit5 on Jul-19-2006 at 19:23

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Originally posted by dj_kane how about this: [[ LINK REMOVED ]]

that was pretty cool

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Originally posted by RapidFire newer trance doesn't know the meaning of subtlety.

+1


I think for some people, if you first heard and enjoyed trance back in the day, you're more likely to prefer it to the new. I know this isn't the case for everyone.

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Originally posted by MrJiveBoJingles Exactly! I don't mind breakdowns at all if they are short and if they don't "take over the whole track" as you said. They can provide a nice breather in a banging set. And again, variety is key.

Exactly, thats why this Nasa set that Rebel9 posted bored me and some other people. I'm not saying the set itself sucked or the music, as that would work great in a big psy festival. But even with a festival or at a club, the tracks just seemed too similar to each other and just kept chugging along without any sense of direction or changing up stuff, build up, tension and release or whatever. That trance mix that was posted by Haak I believe (kk-trancemix2), that had much more variety IMO and took you more on a "journey". It was a great set you could listen to and dance to, and was quite enjoyable IMO. I guess I just look for different things with this music rather than just stuff I can dance to. I guess you could also say I like stuff for the mind and the imagination, not just for the feet.

Last edited by Spirit5 on Jul-19-2006 at 19:38

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Originally posted by Spirit5 Another thing with the breakdown is to make it sound less predictable, more gradual and putting it in different places or making it sound different than just using the same pads or super saws or whatever.

funny I find the usage of breakdowns of most trance stuff today VERY predictable. I mean listen to the stuff which most Armada and Anjunaguys produce today. You can already expect what will come when you play the tune. It's exactly what Ishkur was saying in that other thread. When these kind of tunes are played it's like you are meant to act in a certain way. "Ok here comes the buildup start dancing! and.... now comes the breakdown.... wave your arms for three minutes!! aaand here comes the bassline again dance dance!!" and so on in the next tune and the next.

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My new oldskool TRANCE mix!

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Originally posted by dj_kane 20 years ago? trance? i wouldnt even call the music in the early 90's trance. its old skool with electronic elements. my opinions of trance appear from 95 onwards. everyone has their own opinion on it, some people may see it from the 80s but i disagree.

Your opinion is a load of shite. Old-skool with electronic elements? What the fuck? So what is this breed of old-skool that had nothing electronic about it? And if this music from the early 90s wasn't trance, why was it called that? Surely that which is labelled trance first is trance by default?

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Originally posted by dj_kane yea it is but i still feel it has the 80s electronica feel to it still. the watch out for stella mix updated the sounds which i prefer.

The Watch Out For Stella mix is from 1992. The name refers to Jam & Spoon's track Stella which was out shortly afterwards.

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Originally posted by Spirit5 I don't think it's the breakdown in and of itself that has destroyed trance, because if you go back to the mid 90s, there were still plenty of tracks that had breakdowns, not everything was BOOM BOOM constantly.

Oh yeah. All the old-skool purists still love Caspar Pound's mix of TFMAAT even though it has an absolutely monstrous breakdown.

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Mixes:
> Maximum Elevation [Progressive House]
> DI.FM 26th Anniversary Guest Mix [Progressive House]
> Live @ Dance:Love:Hub London, 11.10.2025
> Higher Peaks [Progressive House]
> Dance:Love:Hub Afterparty (The Return) 23.11.24

Like these sets? Come see me play live at Kibosh in Manchester: https://www.instagram.com/kibosh.mcr/

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Originally posted by SYSTEM-J Your opinion is a load of shite. Old-skool with electronic elements? What the fuck? So what is this breed of old-skool that had nothing electronic about it? And if this music from the early 90s wasn't trance, why was it called that? Surely that which is labelled trance first is trance by default? The Watch Out For Stella mix is from 1992. The name refers to Jam & Spoon's track Stella which was out shortly afterwards. Oh yeah. All the old-skool purists still love Caspar Pound's mix of TFMAAT even though it has an absolutely monstrous breakdown.

yay here comes the most intelligent man in the world. fuck off mate. everyone has a fucking opinion and everyones opinion is different. on your first comment "And if this music from the early 90s wasn't trance, why was it called that? Surely that which is labelled trance first is trance by default?" its called trance because it makes peoples mind feel like its in a state of trance. fucking cheese is classified as trance but i dont regard it as trance so fuck back off to wherever you came from, prune.

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Official Site - www.sterilis.co.uk