quote:

Originally posted by Dj Smitty20 then if that is the case muzzy, do you support euthanasia? Of course you don't. My grandmother has been battling a long lasting and very debilitating liver disease and has been having blood transfusions every 4-6 months for 7 years. It has kept her alive since 1999. Otherwise, she would have died at age 73. She is a devout Anglican and more importantly, wanted to see her grand kids grow up to adulthood. Are you going to tell me that she has "sinned"? Because that's precisely what my JW friend's mother told my father when she came to pick him up after school one time. I couldn't believe the fucking nerve.

Everyone has their own beliefs, Smitty, and I'm sorry that someone was so harsh with you! But quite frankly we're all "sinners" according to the scriptures. We're all in a "sinful" state because of "inherited sin", and "the wages sin pays is death." I'm a "sinner" because I was a fornicator (sex outside of marriage), and a "drunkard" etc. Yep. I can live with it. But I won't take a blood transfusion either.

Oh, and I have euthanised two of my cats to relieve their suffering. But I wouldn't do that to myself or a person.

___________________
"WEMF is...." and I can't remember the rest because I didn't write it down.
- Blackness at WEMF 2007

quote:

Originally posted by muzzybear Everyone has their own beliefs, Smitty, and I'm sorry that someone was so harsh with you! But quite frankly we're all "sinners" according to the scriptures. We're all in a "sinful" state because of "inherited sin", and "the wages sin pays is death." I'm a "sinner" because I was a fornicator (sex outside of marriage), and a "drunkard" etc. Yep. I can live with it. But I won't take a blood transfusion either.

well that's cool man. You should be able to decide if you personally don't want to have one since you are over 18 and should be able to make those decisions (part of the reason I support euthanasia to a degree).

But the issue here (and the only reason I brought this article to everyone's attention) is that the people involved in this case were infants whose parents were willing to let them die! TWO of their OWN CHILDREN already died. That's the real issue here. Who decides whether a minor who is unaware of the larger issues lives or dies?

In this case, I think most people feel the government made the right call.

___________________
"No offense, but you're stupid"

Take the Jehova's Witness quiz.
http://www.thebentinel.com/jw-quiz.php

I got "You are 40% Jehovah's Witness!"

___________________

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quote:

Originally posted by Dj Smitty20 my opinion only but probably that of many others as well, as can be seen from this thread.

Popular opinion doesn't make something right or true. Do you have rocks in your head? LoL.

quote:

Originally posted by jennypie Popular opinion doesn't make something right or true. Do you have rocks in your head? LoL.

Uh oh. Jenny's on a warpath!

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quote:

Originally posted by chinamon not true. i say "ugh" but i am a tranny.

quote:

Originally posted by kotsy lol colour me retarded

quote:

Originally posted by Dj Smitty20 well that's cool man. You should be able to decide if you personally don't want to have one since you are over 18 and should be able to make those decisions (part of the reason I support euthanasia to a degree). But the issue here (and the only reason I brought this article to everyone's attention) is that the people involved in this case were infants whose parents were willing to let them die! TWO of their OWN CHILDREN already died. That's the real issue here. Who decides whether a minor who is unaware of the larger issues lives or dies? In this case, I think most people feel the government made the right call.

Those babies were severely premature and not having a blood transfusion wouldn't have likely made a difference to their recovery (see how many sextuplets have died in the past with blood transfusions). Children are under the care of their parents until they are of legal age. It's disturbing to think that you can't protect your children and raise them with your beliefs in this country.

My brother married a non-witness and she has the legal right to implement whatever treatment she wants for her and my brother's kids. Thank goodness there hasn't been any issues yet, but imagine what a can of worms that's gonna be if it comes up in the future!

This all recently came up too, with the 16 year old who fled BC to come to Ontario because she was undergoing chemo and they wanted to force a transfusion on her. Is 16 too young to know what you want to do with your own body?

___________________
"WEMF is...." and I can't remember the rest because I didn't write it down.
- Blackness at WEMF 2007

quote:

Originally posted by jennypie Popular opinion doesn't make something right or true. Do you have rocks in your head? LoL.

lol, no, I have a brain and it works...sometimes. Of course popular opinion doesn't make it true or false. It just adds some perpsective to this debate.

___________________
"No offense, but you're stupid"

quote:

Originally posted by Abercrombie Take the Jehova's Witness quiz. http://www.thebentinel.com/jw-quiz.php I got "You are 40% Jehovah's Witness!"

I'm 53% ! Hahahahaha!

___________________
"WEMF is...." and I can't remember the rest because I didn't write it down.
- Blackness at WEMF 2007

quote:

Originally posted by Dj Smitty20 lol, no, I have a brain and it works...sometimes. Of course popular opinion doesn't make it true or false. It just adds some perpsective to this debate.

True enough.



Welp...see ya later!

quote:

Originally posted by Abercrombie Take the Jehova's Witness quiz. http://www.thebentinel.com/jw-quiz.php I got "You are 40% Jehovah's Witness!"

I'm 27%. You're a freak!!!!!!

In any case, it is interesting to discuss the pros/cons/whatever, but I still fail to see how any alternative for a transfusion can be given to a baby. True, there are plasma, saline, and other alternatives, however, these are only viable as a one-time use alternatives, and as a resort if there is not enough donor blood. Stating the Red Cross to be a money making company...well...as relevant as that is, its not really all that much in line with the discussion of the moment. Saline replacement and whatnot would have provided a very dangerous replacement for a transfusion. I guess the point I'm trying to make is that from a strictly 'technical' viewpoint, a transfusion sometimes IS the better way.

Maybe I'm a little too ignorant of JW, but I've spoken to a few, sometimes quite at length, and I just do not agree with a strong belief like that. Then again, are they SO different than other religions to be found today?
I just don't understand some things. For example, I've had it said that as a JW, if your family isn't, contact with them will be discouraged. I don't know why this part stood out. There is a lot of unity there, but a lot of clut-like behaiviours, IMO.

Just a question muzzybear if you don't mind. How do your family and their JW contacts feel about your way of life? I hope I'm not prying, and I don't mean to be offensive. I'm genuinely curious as to the family dynamic..

quote:

Originally posted by zokissima Just a question muzzybear if you don't mind. How do your family and their JW contacts feel about your way of life? I hope I'm not prying, and I don't mean to be offensive. I'm genuinely curious as to the family dynamic..

I, like many people, have no trouble talking about myself or my beliefs! Har har! My Great Aunt always used to tell me that "bad association spoils useful habits" because she didn't like my friend Nancy (who was a Roman Catholic and "loose as a goose" in high school to put it mildly!)

My sister is a non-witness too, and we have little contact with my brother who is a really bad example of a baptized Witness (I probably do a better job of preaching than he does, and I don't go to the Kingdom Hall!).

I'm totally close with my very faithful mother, but she's always throwing in little nuggets of scripture to kind of scare me back to the faith. I hear stories of how my mom's uncle Percy was disfellowshipped 5 times because he stole from the treasury. Too funny! I totally believe in what they teach, but have not had great experiences with some of the Witnesses, so I choose to live my life outside of the faith and have friends who don't judge me and I don't judge them (I guess I'm prepared to "die with my eyes wide open" for lack of a better way to put it). There's been many great 4am chats, and I have a lot of knowledge of the scriptures, so it's always fun to talk amongst ourselves about what makes us tick.

___________________
"WEMF is...." and I can't remember the rest because I didn't write it down.
- Blackness at WEMF 2007

quote:

Originally posted by muzzybear

Thanks, I appreciate you taking the time.
lol at your mom throwing little comments. Sounds like a typical good mom
Did you find that the younger crowd of the JW are a lot more judgemental than the older individuals whom have kids and whatnot?