I did compare the tracks, and I must say i think the Rank 1 Superstring sounds phatter and clearer, while the original Superstring indeed sounds very analog..

I uploaded some samples for you too judge for yourself.

Cygnus X - Superstring

Rank 1 - Superstring

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quote:

Originally posted by thoughtlessjex Go listen to a song like Cygnus X - Superstring. That's not a Supersaw. It's four years too early. That's a unison effect made with an analog synthesizer. That is warmth. Now go listen to System F - Out of the Blue. The famed supersaw pales in comparison. It only sounds good when a chorus effect is added, which is pretty much a unison effect. I'd be willing to bet that even Cygnus X used a chorus on whatever synth they were using. Seriously, I get a perfectly fine chorus effect out of Synth1 by just detuning the second ocsillator, noodling the chorus to where I like it and pressing the unison button. Voila, warm thick sounds. Not necessarily as warm as analog unison, but then neither was the JP 8080 supersaw.

Have you even heard the original superstring (not the remixes)? It sounds like it was made on a Casio keyboard.

Chorus != Unison.

Unison was a feature on analogue polysynths that stacked all voices onto a single key (which basically made it into a monosynth as you could only play one note at a time). In order to not totally destroy headroom, these voices were detuned apart progressively so as not to suddenly make the synth output really loud. At this time polyphonic synths were only capable of about 4 or 5 voices.

If you have used Pro53 then thats the way unison used to behave and its a similar deal with the Juno106 and other unison capable synths.

The supersaw is an oscillator that gets around the limited polyphony of the synth by having many detuned oscillators per voice. Now that you can get synths with many discrete oscillators and a massive polyphony of something like 80 voices this idea is practically redundant but in order to clone the supersaw oscillator you would still need a sawtooth waveform which sounds like a JP8000 saw tooth.

As for cloning instruments. I am of the same opinion on the issue as Howard Scarr - a sound designer for Access. Cloning instruments is an academic exercise. In the same way you learn how to draw by copying the drawings of others or by copying what you see in real life - you learn how to design sounds by first deconstructing the work of others.

Unlike drawing though, once you have a good clone of a nice sound, you can easily turn it into something equally complex but totally different sounding by changing oscillator waveforms or by fiddling with envelopes and LFOS.

Also, by cloning sounds you learn in massive detail how these sounds are created, which in turn gives you some pretty deep knowledge of how to create sounds on synthesizers. I think everyone should give cloning a go. Its a great way to learn. But if you only want a supersaw and you don't want the hassle of this cloning business (which will not yield perfect results - only ideas), I cant tell you the short of it - its not worth your time. If you want a supersaw and thats your only interest, just buy a JP8000. Save yourself the time and hassle.

Now if you want to get into the process of synthesizing analogue string sounds and understanding what makes a supersaw sound the way it does, then thats different.

Last edited by Derivative on Apr-05-2007 at 15:55

get fucking reaktor, there was like a supersaw plugin nocking about for it about a year and a half ago it was top stuff for the rank 1 version of the track, for the original though im not sure, top track though

quote:

Originally posted by Project 7 get fucking reaktor, there was like a supersaw plugin nocking about for it about a year and a half ago it was top stuff for the rank 1 version of the track, for the original though im not sure, top track though

RB2k1 you mean. yea, it's pretty cool.

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quote:

Originally posted by Project 7 get fucking reaktor, there was like a supersaw plugin nocking about for it about a year and a half ago it was top stuff for the rank 1 version of the track, for the original though im not sure, top track though

But the Reaktor costs the same as a JP

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I'm currently developing a VSTi that has pretty decent supersaw oscillators. You can make JP-80X0ish sounds with it easily. I will post it when It's finished.

Nice one man, keep us updated.

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Signature Suspended as it was deemed offensive

First of all: Read the stickies, your question is answered there
Second matter: Try Synth-1. People tend to forget that it now has a massive detuning feature, great for creating supersaws
get it here: http://www.geocities.jp/daichi1969/softsynth/ (scroll down until you find "Synth1 Ver 1.07(2006.5.3) : synth1v107.zip (607K bytes)")

(to install, unzip the file to your desktop, find the synth1 VST.dll and CWDXPX1.DLL files and copy to the same location you put Superwave P8, if that worked for you)

Here is a simple patch if created:
http://www.yousendit.com/transfer.p...7E7B3B32668F16F

To load it in FL Studio, add an instance of Synth-1 to your FL project, press the little arrow in the corner of the window and choose "Import Cubase bank/preset

Try messing with the cutoff and amplifier envelope attack (labeled "A")
I hope this helps

quote:

Originally posted by Subtle I have only heard the Rank 1 mix of that track, and i think they used the JP8000 for the remix. But i definitely see your point, I will get the original track, and see how that sounds.. Nonetheless, the 7 detuned saws are hard to emulate with software, especially when u want the filter to sound as good. And the supersaw by definition is the waveform from the JP 8000, so the original Superstring wasnt actually a supersaw.

The Rank 1 sound has a sub-line added as well as a hell of a lot of chorus. It's far away from the original supersaw sound. Also note that I never said that Cygnus X's sound was a supesrsaw. I said sounds like that are what the supersaw sought to emulate.

quote:

Have you even heard the original superstring (not the remixes)? It sounds like it was made on a Casio keyboard.

I honestly prefer it to a straight supersaw. If you're going to tell me that something that sounds like a middle school violin section sounds better than that smooth "Casio keyboard," you have no business telling me what sounds good and what doesn't.

And yes, even that violin section will sound good if you add a sub and the proper amount of chorus, which is why the Rank 1 mix sounds so thick and smooth.

quote:

Chorus != Unison

Not precisely, no, but that's really not the point. The point is that the supersaw sought to emulate the latter, but failed to do so without the former. I'm not Matthias Hoffman, so I can't say, but like I said, it's possible.

I suppose my point is really that it's not all that awesome of a sound to begin with, so emulating it is stupid, IMO.

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You can also try Supersaw Plus @ http://www.atodvst.com/

Closest vst I have heard to a real 8080

Also the Adam Van Baker Sytrus preset

http://www.adamszabo.com/files/Adam_Van_Baker_Sytrus_JP-8000_Supersaw.zip

Last edited by xenpro on Apr-06-2007 at 05:45

quote:

Originally posted by xenpro You can also try Supersaw Plus @ http://www.atodvst.com/ Closest vst I have heard to a real 8080

It can make the same idea of sounds but thats not even close to the jp. not at all. lcks all the phatness.
I don't consider my self a pro with the jp at all and I've done that - [[ LINK REMOVED ]]
which makes the SuperSaw Plus sound like vanguard.
A z3ta+ would do much more then that vsti.
Thats my opinion.
I've yet to see something so close coming out of a vsti, unless it's either coming out of:
* Reaktor with the RB2K1 where the 6 detuned saw osc's sound a bit more realistic then other vsti's.
- OR -
* Vaz Modular.

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Last edited by 3rd Signal on Apr-06-2007 at 07:20