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| quote: | Originally posted by LatinLover
The dems are a joke... all they do is sit on capitol hill and wine all day. |
Do you ever have anything new to say? Jesus, it seems that every post you create starts off with the same "Dems. are a joke" sentiment.
Are you sure you're an "Independent"?
| quote: | | They bring no resolutions to the table, |
Hmmm, I guess all those bills and specific Iraq resolution for strategic redeployment is nonexistent in your world, huh?
| quote: | | and they are the ones to blame for the division that exists in this country. |
Stop. Just fucking quit your incessant bitching right now. You've got a lot of nerve for:
1. Repeating your same message ad nauseum
2. Pretending to be an Independent
3. Trying to pin the blame of all of Iraq's problems on the Democrats
The Democrats are not the ones who pushed us into war, if I recall correctly. You remember who wanted this war? You remember who's majority party overwhelmingly voted for it in Congress?
You remember who's party this Administration represents?
You remember who's party sold that bullshit story on WMD stockpiles and al Qaeda connections to the public, while handwaving away all evidence to the contrary?
You remember who's party Don Rumsfeld represents, who literally went into this war with ABSOLUTELY NO FUCKING PLAN TO REBUILD IRAQ'S INFRASTRUCTURE?
You remember who's party called out all dissenters of this war as unAmerican and unpatriotic?
You remember who's party this Administration represents WHO HAS NOT BEEN CORRECT ON ANY OF THEIR PREDICTIONS ABOUT THIS WAR THUS FAR?
You remember who's party this Administration represents and who's party fully supports surge after surge after surge in the past, to which NO SURGES have been successful in their goals of quelling violence?
(hint: it begins with an "R")
Do yourself and everyone else a favor, my dear CONSERVATIVE, and start examining who the real culprit is on the rift in this country. Bush and his followers have done this all by themselves, all on their own, and no one else. It just took some Americans a little bit longer to figure it out.
| quote: | | I mean how can we win a war or better yet find an overall solution to our problems in the ME and such division exists? |
Yeah, some "uniter and not a divider" huh?
Oh wait, I forgot, it's all the Democrats' fault. It's NEVER the fault of this Administration and the Republicans.
| quote: | | As someone mention its better for them to sit down and engage in constructive negotiations and not run around screaming withdrawal... |
Well you're just gonna have to forgive those darn Democrats who have that silly tendency to understand reality a bit better. And besides, Bush does not negotiate on anything.
Give me one fucking instance to which this Administration has EVER negotiated on something, ESPECIALLY when it comes to Iraq. Just one time will do, and don't be fucking dishonest.
Bush has a complete disdain for Congress, even when it was run by Republicans. Congress is nothing but a nuissance to a man who's Administration believes and adheres to the power of the Unitary Executive. The only negotiation Bush has done ever with Congress is when he gets his way with the Republicans, which is not a negotiation. He doesn't nor will he ever give a shit about Congress. You ask for Congress to negotiate? How do you negotiate with someone who doesn't give a shit about Congress, or brings this philosophy to the table?:
| quote: | Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice urged the Democratic-controlled Congress not to interfere in the conduct of the Iraq war today and suggested President George W. Bush would defy troop withdrawal legislation.
http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/...10/0/BUSINESS01 |
Who's not negotiating again?
| quote: | | they are just simply taking advantage over the fact that many Americans are tired of the war. |
Yeah, that must be it.
Let's not pay attention to this Administration politicizing the shit out of this war and the War on Terra every chance they've had over the past 5 1/2 years. Hell, they've run an entire platform of elections in '02, '04, and again in '06 on scaring the bejesus out of anyone if they vote for a Democrat, because that's supposedly what the terrorists want.
I'm sorry, but you really having a problem wrapping your head around the idea that a party wants to do what the American public wants them to do? Gosh, how horrid.
| quote: | | But do Americans truly know whats in stake if we withdraw? I mean dems shout withdrawal.. how about if we engage in a national dialogue and explain to Americans about the aftermath of a possible withdrawal. I Guarantee that Americans would change their minds about a possible withdrawal. |
Are you an American? Do you know honestly how Americans feel? Here in Kansas, I'm surrounded by a sea of Red. Republicans are everywhere, and THEY are wanting out of this war with a timeline to withdraw. They're done here. They're cashing in, slowly but surely. They're tired of seeing their sons and daughters die fighting in a civil war between two Islamist factions that had nothing to do with 9/11.
I'm sorry, but Americans have made up their minds on their own. It's not the "librul" media, it's not the Democrats. It's just plain common fucking sense.
Something you sincerely lack.
| quote: | | As I always said some people have to take unpopular decisions to do the right thing. |
What's so right about being caught in the middle of a civil war and fighting for an oppressionist fundamentalist Shiite regime in leagues with Iran who's leader is doing things like this?:
| quote: | BAGHDAD, Iraq (CNN) -- Iraq's prime minister has created an entity within his government that U.S. and Iraqi military officials say is being used as a smokescreen to hide an extreme Shiite agenda that is worsening the country's sectarian divide.
The Office of the Commander in Chief has the power to overrule other government ministries, according to U.S. military and intelligence sources.
Those sources say the 24-member office is abusing its power, increasingly overriding decisions made by the Iraqi Ministries of Defense and Interior and potentially undermining the entire U.S. effort in Iraq.
http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/meast/05/01/iraq.office/ |
What's so right about that? Because they'll follow us here if we don't? And the evidence for Iraqi Sunni factions will do that is, what again? Because a recent survey of military and intelligence analysts believe such a silly idea is "remote at best":
http://www.realcities.com/mld/krwas...shington_nation
What is your evidence to the contrary?
| quote: | | Clearly bush fucked up in his strategy to invade Iraq, better yet the invasion was a big military success, but he wasnt prepare for the resistance that was coming his way. |
Wasn't prepared and didn't give a fuck:
| quote: | The Bush administration never drew up a comprehensive plan for rebuilding Iraq after the March 2003 invasion, which contributed to a severe shortage of skilled federal workers in Baghdad and to the mismanagement of the country’s oil money, according to a new government report.
http://www.washingtontimes.com/nati...02546-2603r.htm |
And there was plenty of people telling him EXACTLY what kind of mess he would create should he invade Iraq. But neither he or Rummy paid any attention to them:
| quote: | A review by former intelligence officers has concluded that the Bush administration ‘apparently paid little or no attention’ to prewar assessments by the Central Intelligence Agency that warned of major cultural and political obstacles to stability in postwar Iraq.
.....The same intelligence unit that produced a gloomy report in July about the prospect of growing instability in Iraq warned the Bush administration about the potential costly consequences of an American-led invasion two months before the war began, government officials said Monday.
http://select.nytimes.com/search/re...DA00894DC404482
“U.S. intelligence agencies repeatedly warned the White House beginning more than two years ago that the insurgency in Iraq had deep local roots, was likely to worsen and could lead to civil war, according to former senior intelligence officials who helped craft the reports.”
http://www.realcities.com/mld/krwas...shington_nation |
| quote: | | But yet the Dems use this war to make a political point. Our enemy is happy that our nation is divided. |
Our enemy is actually much, much happier that we are in Iraq. Bin laden couldn't be happier that our forces are there stretched so thin and completely bogged down. Bush has been bin Laden's greatest friend, perhaps not purposely, but he has helped bin Laden's cause better than anyone else. By diverting his attention away from bin Laden in Tora Bora and attacking Iraq which had nothing to do with bin Laden or 9/11, our presence has been a terrific tool of recruitment for al Qaeda and other terrorist organizations.
Doesn't that make you feel all warm inside?
Besides, didn't your buddy Zawari say this in the story you posted?:
| quote: | “This bill will deprive us of the opportunity to destroy the American forces which we have caught in a historic trap,” al-Zawahri said, according to a transcript released by the monitoring group SITE. The bill is evidence of American “failure and frustration,” he added.
“We ask Allah that they (U.S. troops) only get out of it after losing 200,000 to 300,000 killed, in order that we give the spillers of blood in Washington and Europe an unforgettable lesson,” he said.
http://www.tranceaddict.com/forums/...121&forumid=66& |
So who's siding with the terrorists again? Who's side is this Administration on again? The American public, or the terrorists?
| quote: | | They know all they have to do is wait till we grow tire and retreat as it happened in Vietnam, thou this war is more complex than Vietnam in many angles. |
You know, it's funny how every time we run across another war, you always here the same thing: we are confronting a "different" enemy. We are in a "different" kind of war.
Yet the outcome is still the same - people die, war is hell, governments and civil strife, famine, disease run amok. It's a sad and redundant argument that's only a mere excuse to save your own ass while someone comes along for others to blame for your mistakes instead. Honestly I don't give a fuck who we blame anymore, so long as we have a phased withdrawal out of that mess.
Did it ever occur to you that we might actually be part of the problem and not the solution with our presence there? Because really now, take a good look at what's been going on there over the past 4 years - has our presence truly helped the situation at all? Perhaps, just perhaps we should consider the alternative thought away from destructive neocon philosophy and begin to understand that our presence isn't helping the situation, AND WE'RE GETTING OUR PEOPLE KILLED IN THE PROCESS.
Again, you'll just have to forgive the American public for considering that alternative.
| quote: | | What pisses me off is that many individuals have forgotten that our troops are there to fight for America NOT BUSH! Our brave men and women are representing AMERICA not Bush. This is Americas war not Bushs war. |
I'm not sure what you're arguing here. I'm not arguing anything about the troops at all. I am arguing against the policies that sent them there and KEEP them there which is set forth by this Administration. Bringing up the troops is irrelevant. They are merely following orders set forth by this Administration.
They take orders and the policies set down are from someone other than this Administration, so the focus on what is occurring in Iraq should remain on the policies that's keeping them there.
Lastly, again I ask (to which you continue to ignore):
| quote: | Given the fact that hardly any predictions made by this Administration and its supporters have come to fruition about this war in Iraq, why the fuck do you think you have an ounce of credibility to make any predictions about the situation in the future? Given your support to the group that's been wrong on almost all accounts with this war, what on earth should compel anyone to start believing your predictions now?
And lastly, again I wonder, do you think it's okay for Bush to call for a timetable of withdrawal against Clinton back in 1999? |
___________________
Whence September dusk grows crisper still,
with leaves all crimson conquered,
I yearn to shout,
and dance about,
and stick pickles in my honker...
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let me just correct myself. this is not a war whats going on in iraq its just an operation 
