I'm sure you get used to beatmatching, but the fact that the process occupies one of those decks for a lot of the time just takes up resources. I'd still like to get some proper CDJs to have that extra hands-on flexibility.

As for ableton, I think it depends on how you use it. If you're just throwing stuff into arrangement mode & basically putting a puzzle together, I'll agree that it's a bit cheap. I didn't even know that that existed, though, until I was well into using live, so I just got used to doing everything on-the-spot. I don't think there's anything wrong with that, since I'm doing the same spontaneous adjustments, & none of it's programmed or automated. Same knobs, faders, etc. I know there are people who think that anything that doesn't involve beatmatching isn't DJing, but that's really just busy work. Yes, you can fuck it up, but it's not like you can do an insane job at it, like you can with the actual mixing or fx & what not. Nobody comes back from an event and says, "holy shit, man. those beats were so ridiculously synced up! Fuckin insane! That guy's not even human!" If you don't have to do that, it just gives you more time & attention to put into the other stuff.

Warping's not so bad, except when you start dealing with more unusual stuff, and then it will drive you crazy. I hate when I load a track in, and ableton puts in 5000 warp markers with a range from 60-150. "Well, there goes my afternoon." I remember the first time I tried putting an aphex twin track in there. It was like that scene in christmas vacation, where chevy chase hands his son the 2-foot ball of lights & says, "Oh...looks like we've got a little knot. Take care of that, son."

The main thing I love about Live is looping & what not. I almost can't imagine not being able to just skip around in a track, perfectly on tempo, with one move. Yes, you can do it, but all I have to do is click on a bar. Want it to actually loop? enter 6 numbers, click another button. Want to shorten/move the loop? drag a bar. Want to alternate between them? copy, paste, change numbers, assign a couple triggers, & within 30 seconds, you're set.

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Last edited by shaw on Sep-02-2007 at 16:30

I'm well aware, I've tried doing sets with it...i just always end up forgetting something and fucking it up.(i like traktor a little better to mix with.)All comes down to what you are comfortable with. The day ableton chooses your tracks for you is the day i will say you are less of a dj. "The medium is the message"

Even though we use diff ways of doing it, we still like cheesy comedy quotes. Hating ableton isn't cool anymore. I'd much rather hate Tommy Lee, Torque, and people who pay Deadmau5 tons of money to do nothing but play a pre recorded set of his own productions, act like Peter Hook, all while throwing a shitload of effects over it. Its like paying a prostitute not to have sex with you imo.

I can remember seeing Richie Hawtin play one of his first Final Scratch sets...it blew my fucking mind what he could do. Was he less of a DJ for bringing an overall more original performance to the table? Uh uh....fuck hijacking my own threads lol. This is what too many redbulls and cubase block do to a person.

indeed. the main thing is having enough controls. I started out recording stuff live with live 4, a keyboard, & a mouse, so I guess I had to learn to be completely paranoid about staying on top of everything that was going on (it takes a little more concentration to trigger the right clips when they're assigned to z, x, c, & v, and you have effects' on/off switches on asdf...lol). The main reason software's gotten a bad rap is that people can't see what's going on, and the DJ's not sitting up there holding his headphones on his shoulder like they all do in movies & tv shows (along with constantly scratching & never touching the mixer). People think it's boring to watch, and the guys playing their limewire library out definitely aren't helping the authenticity debate, either. There's just such a wide range of the functions people use software for. As long as there's still improvisation going on, I don't have a problem with it. If you're doing a promo, that's one thing, but if you're showing up to a gig with your entire set already cued up, and all you do is trigger a couple actions you've already pre-programmed, it's not much better than just playing a mix cd & twisting a couple knobs here & there.

I'm sure there will be a point where someone creates a site with preset transitions (times to bring in another track, etc. for each track. pick two, it matches up the points, applies the recommended EQing, & voila--you have a transition), so you can just pick tracks, put them in order in your cart, & download your "mix."

also, energy drinks suck.

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Jerking off sucks if you don't use any hands

The problem isnt software but everyone putting it in their head that they are going to be a fucking superstar. If you don't enjoy than quit because they most likely won't be the next big thing. Dj ing will take a back seat very soon to live acts. (Ironically the ableton sequencer is a major force behind this too. Ie: The villalobos band...forget the name.Luciano and a bunch of other guys. Saw them at mutek and it was nuts.) Its already happening...Trentemoller and Booka Shade parties are better than any DJ set i have been to. My number one night of all time was a Speedy J live act.Intense stuff and the talent level surpases any Dj's.I only do this shit because I'm older, can't party like when I was younger but still love the music. Energy drinks do suck...but I have been sober for awhile and well yeah.


"Get a room you fucks"

Download my mix win a free ipod!

ps people who go to watch the dj are retarded. What better dishonour to do to someone than not dance. You want to show a dj he is doing good..dance. 2 feet on the floor, back to the booth, and if your hands are in the air someone better have a gun drawn on you. Seriously...the perty is the party not the dj. If only those idiots knew how much DJ's hate the peeping toms.

Last edited by AlleN F on Sep-02-2007 at 17:27

DJs will always be around, because there aren't enough consistently good producers to fill the demand for people playing edm in clubs. also, there's more time for jesus poses if you don't have to actually make the sounds.

and I'd rather stand to the side or in back, relax & lean against something & see what's actually going on (without actually intruding). Maybe that's even more annoying...idk...but it's a lot more interesting for me.

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Hey thats your thing. I'm not a fan of that but thats me. Just know that Dj's often make fun of you guys. The greatest thing i have ever seen was from Lee Burridge. We used to have a afterhours here in Montreal called ARIA. The booth was more to the back/middle of the room and had plexiglass around the back to make it easier to watch. Some guy literally did not move at all during one of his sets...and just looked at Lee the whole fucking time with a zombie expression. Lee got annoyed a bit after awhile, and shouted to him," Is this a bloody nightclub or a fucking aquarium? Do you think i'm a fish you c*nt?" He then started jumping around and making fish faces. I don't think i have ever laughed so hard during a club night in my life. Lee is an amazing guy, he is just crazy like that and parties as much as the people on the floor. You should have seen the fanboys face.

ps..name me 10 popular dj's that have no productions.

lol. If there was glass there, that would just be bizarre. It's only if it's a pretty open area, and I know some of the people there. I'm not just gonna stand there by myself with an intense look, like I'm studying everything. that is weird.

edit: w/e

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Last edited by shaw on Sep-02-2007 at 18:08

and yeah, all of them have productions, but not enough to fill an hour or two with stuff people recognize & enjoy. Some stuff doesn't lend itself to entertaining live production, either.

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You would be surprised. Not every DJ/Producer releases everything he/she produces. They don't tend to only play their own tracks, because many believe its a faux pas...ie: The age old adage that if a track is good enough others will promote it for you. I have had the luck to see a couple laptops of DJ's that aren't known for their productions as much as their DJ'ing. They all have tons of loops and stuff you have never heard..not so much before , but now more than ever. Then you can use the example of Stephan Bodzin, who only uses his own stuff in sets, and it never sounds the same.

lol this thread is going to be big.

if you read this guys, i'm not doing this to bump..just because this is the most interesting convo i have had since being on tranceaddict.

(keep posting they will think the mix is the bomb by the number of pages(i think it is vote freak top dj mag 100)...say it...I SAID SAY IT!)

lol.

No, I'm fully aware of the amount of unreleased/incomplete/justforperformance stuff that a lot of people use (just look at any ableton screenshots...those 500 clips can't all be tracks), but I'm coming at it from the perspective that there's not the demand for it. If somebody can't fill that time with original productions that people A: have heard of & B: won't stop dancing and/or boo when they get played, they're not going to do 'live PAs.' They'll just do a DJ set, instead, since it's easier to do and to vary. There are a lot of tracks that are fun to hear in a dj set, but wouldn't be any different live. If it's just a,b,c for 16 bars, add d, add e, add f, isolate one, etc., it's not the same as the stuff you can work over & over & over with lemurs & live & all sorts of fx, or play with live instruments. Even though you may care about how it looks, that's the most significant difference between the two for 99% of people. If they don't look much different, there's not much of a point.

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Watch a perfromance with DJ Tom and Trentemoller...this will change the way you view dj'ing. The Dj is a tool and not the main act.Is it easier this way? No..but it blows it away. When I saw Trente last year it was surreal. Like a rock concert that people danced to. (not one person stood..you had no choice but to dance it was that damn good.) Another example is Mutek..The Technologies introduced during this and the live performances you see there make you never want to see a normal DJ again. What they are doing isnt easier.(you should see how many Channels Mathew Johnson aka Cobblestone Jazz has to play with). It isn't today, but it is the definate future. You need to see it to believe it, but once you do you realize..."Holy Shit why am i going to pay for a guy that plays cd's when i can get this." It seems like a stretch but save this quote and come see me in 2 years.

I'm agreeing with you. It's clearly more difficult.

And yes, Mutek's in the plans...

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