quote:

Originally posted by mysticalninja What no britney? Think you're too good for britney spears? Lol jk.

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Originally posted by mysticalninja Horse Bassline = Oopma Oopma Bad analogy = Bad. Whatever. There will always be people who listen to music for how it sounds (me) and people who listen to it because of the technical complexity and the image of intelligence it portrays (you). I'll take my candy sugar cereal. (even though that analogy was horrible and THE most pompous thing i've heard in my life) Now if you'll excuse me I'm going to go get hyphy.

I don't see what was wrong with his analogy. You keep referring to it as "technical complexity" but it has nothing to do with that. Some products or works of art are simply aimed at a narrower audience; that does not make them pretentious, nor does it make the audience a bunch of hipsters. It can, but that's not a given.

Kraft Dinner sells on a wider scale than fresh pasta. More people eat at your local McDonald's or Taco Bell than at the sushi bars or authentic Mexican restaurants. If you think that the customers in the second group are just trying to look sophisticated, then you really ought to be taken out and shot. These are all technically "food", but that makes about as much sense as saying that country and gangsta rap are all technically "music". They represent completely different business models, cultures, and target audiences.

If you don't like the food analogy, then just pick some other type of art. Any back issue of Hustler magazine will probably appeal to a wider audience today than nude paintings from the impressionistic period, but in spite of the superficial similarities, you're really comparing apples and oranges there. People don't buy paintings for the same reason that they buy porn. In the same vein, people don't go out searching for obscure music for the same reason that other people listen to Fiddy Cent. If you're looking for a hook-up, you go with mainstream rap; if you want to heighten the sensation from your drug cocktail, you pick trance or house, and if you just want to bust your best moves, you go with breaks or maybe the more underground rap.

You ought to understand this very well with your Bay Area culture that's all about the "stupid". Why not just listen to regular gangsta rap, buy regular Fubu clothes, speak the regular hip-hop slang and go to regular hip-hop clubs? That's what pretty much everybody else in North America does and is quite satisfied with, and quite frankly, they all think that you Hephies are a bunch of pretentious fucknuts who are so obsessed with being different that you don't care whether or not your shit is actually any good.

Not that I agree with them - I'm just sayin'. Almost everybody has their passions, their hobbies, where they take a deeper interest than the fluff that gets exposed on the mass market. That alone does not make them pretentious; it's only when they start to thumb their noses at the unwashed masses for not rejecting the "commercial crap" that it becomes pretentious.

And yeah, it's a late reply and the original post was probably just taking the piss. Sue me, I've been away.

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Many music styles have a particular sound by way of chord progression, just listen to a lot of rock music but you get people breaking the routine all the time.
Doesn't mean one is wrong or right. Sure there is a quite a common chord progression in a lot of tracks but you also have a lot that have great variation.

But your friend needs to give trance another listen as there are a lot of tracks out there that don't use the formula as well. It all comes down to the musical knowledge and song writing ability of the composer at the end of the day, but also a question of if it sounds good or not.

Sure, AFG has been done to death, but that's not a trance thing, that's all music. Your hear it everywhere you go. If someone is starting out playing keyboard it's probably one of the first pleasing combinations they well find for themselves. It's all white keys and it's simple.

Take typical Blues chords, if you play a pentatonic scale in lets say E, you will find the switch to A natural for that type of music. Then go to B. Back to A and then back to E. Standard formula for basic blues but people are still writing tracks like that and it works.

At the end of the day it's always good to branch out and try new stuff, keeps the learning experience going.

You can get some nice results with suspended chords and accidentals too.

As for the other discussion... gah!

Cheers
Nem

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quote:

Originally posted by DigiNut I don't see what was wrong with his analogy. You keep referring to it as "technical complexity" but it has nothing to do with that. Some products or works of art are simply aimed at a narrower audience; that does not make them pretentious, nor does it make the audience a bunch of hipsters. It can, but that's not a given. Kraft Dinner sells on a wider scale than fresh pasta. More people eat at your local McDonald's or Taco Bell than at the sushi bars or authentic Mexican restaurants. If you think that the customers in the second group are just trying to look sophisticated, then you really ought to be taken out and shot. These are all technically "food", but that makes about as much sense as saying that country and gangsta rap are all technically "music". They represent completely different business models, cultures, and target audiences. If you don't like the food analogy, then just pick some other type of art. Any back issue of Hustler magazine will probably appeal to a wider audience today than nude paintings from the impressionistic period, but in spite of the superficial similarities, you're really comparing apples and oranges there. People don't buy paintings for the same reason that they buy porn. In the same vein, people don't go out searching for obscure music for the same reason that other people listen to Fiddy Cent. If you're looking for a hook-up, you go with mainstream rap; if you want to heighten the sensation from your drug cocktail, you pick trance or house, and if you just want to bust your best moves, you go with breaks or maybe the more underground rap. You ought to understand this very well with your Bay Area culture that's all about the "stupid". Why not just listen to regular gangsta rap, buy regular Fubu clothes, speak the regular hip-hop slang and go to regular hip-hop clubs? That's what pretty much everybody else in North America does and is quite satisfied with, and quite frankly, they all think that you Hephies are a bunch of pretentious fucknuts who are so obsessed with being different that you don't care whether or not your shit is actually any good. Not that I agree with them - I'm just sayin'. Almost everybody has their passions, their hobbies, where they take a deeper interest than the fluff that gets exposed on the mass market. That alone does not make them pretentious; it's only when they start to thumb their noses at the unwashed masses for not rejecting the "commercial crap" that it becomes pretentious. And yeah, it's a late reply and the original post was probably just taking the piss. Sue me, I've been away.

Well said.

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Originally posted by DigiNut I don't see what was wrong with his analogy. You keep referring to it as "technical complexity" but it has nothing to do with that. Some products or works of art are simply aimed at a narrower audience; that does not make them pretentious, nor does it make the audience a bunch of hipsters. It can, but that's not a given. Kraft Dinner sells on a wider scale than fresh pasta. More people eat at your local McDonald's or Taco Bell than at the sushi bars or authentic Mexican restaurants. If you think that the customers in the second group are just trying to look sophisticated, then you really ought to be taken out and shot. These are all technically "food", but that makes about as much sense as saying that country and gangsta rap are all technically "music". They represent completely different business models, cultures, and target audiences. If you don't like the food analogy, then just pick some other type of art. Any back issue of Hustler magazine will probably appeal to a wider audience today than nude paintings from the impressionistic period, but in spite of the superficial similarities, you're really comparing apples and oranges there. People don't buy paintings for the same reason that they buy porn. In the same vein, people don't go out searching for obscure music for the same reason that other people listen to Fiddy Cent. If you're looking for a hook-up, you go with mainstream rap; if you want to heighten the sensation from your drug cocktail, you pick trance or house, and if you just want to bust your best moves, you go with breaks or maybe the more underground rap. You ought to understand this very well with your Bay Area culture that's all about the "stupid". Why not just listen to regular gangsta rap, buy regular Fubu clothes, speak the regular hip-hop slang and go to regular hip-hop clubs? That's what pretty much everybody else in North America does and is quite satisfied with, and quite frankly, they all think that you Hephies are a bunch of pretentious fucknuts who are so obsessed with being different that you don't care whether or not your shit is actually any good. Not that I agree with them - I'm just sayin'. Almost everybody has their passions, their hobbies, where they take a deeper interest than the fluff that gets exposed on the mass market. That alone does not make them pretentious; it's only when they start to thumb their noses at the unwashed masses for not rejecting the "commercial crap" that it becomes pretentious. And yeah, it's a late reply and the original post was probably just taking the piss. Sue me, I've been away.

Umm I most definitely consider ganster rap and country music. ....get off your fucking high horse.

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people don't go out searching for obscure music for the same reason that other people listen to Fiddy Cent.

You're right they don't, but I don't think either of those people do either of those things for the music. People listen to 50 cent because he's hardcore, he's the real deal, he really did all the things he talks about etc, and people go out and look for obscure music no ones heard of because of the "oh somethings popular ill be different and not like it" mentallity that seems to be expanding with each generation.

And the food analogy where you compare musical tastes with healthy food vs junk food is THE most ridiculous analogy I may of ever heard.

quote:

Originally posted by Sanguis Mortuum Well said.

Heh you're such a mindless follower. That's why you don't understand compression beyond the basic textbook definition.

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Last edited by mysticalninja on Sep-04-2007 at 22:02

quote:

Originally posted by DigiNut Any back issue of Hustler magazine will probably appeal to a wider audience today than nude paintings from the impressionistic period, but in spite of the superficial similarities, you're really comparing apples and oranges there. People don't buy paintings for the same reason that they buy porn.

I thought porn was art....

Traditionally, people did buy paintings for the same reason as porn. There is a definite erotic aspect that you can't deny in a lot of art. I don't think you should sideline thatq.

But; back to the original topic! In all music there are favoured progressions E > A > B is one of the most standard, but there is so much room to maneuver even there, you can go from delta blues to hard rock to melodic pop rock and back again. So a "trance" chord progression is really not worth thinking about!

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Im not actually a trance producer so can someone give me an example of a classic trance chord progression?

Does the average trance tune use say a 3 chord progression, to form the pads or arp pattern?

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Originally posted by Head Grit Im not actually a trance producer so can someone give me an example of a classic trance chord progression? Does the average trance tune use say a 3 chord progression, to form the pads or arp pattern?

Probably not actually, I would say at least 4, but often repeated and then the second time round there will be a variation in the progression. But you also frequently get other variations too.

You will also find that the age of the trance can make a difference but usually only in complexity of the over all track. Probably the think that changed on that front is the percussion and bass. But these are just my ramblings.

cheers
Nem

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quote:

Originally posted by mysticalninja And the food analogy where you compare musical tastes with healthy food vs junk food is THE most ridiculous analogy I may of ever heard.

Looks like you missed the point of the analogy. It wasn't about healthiness vs. unhealthiness or "bad taste" vs. "good taste." I don't think that popular music is bad because it's popular, but it does need to be immediately accessible in order to be popular: otherwise it wouldn't be liked by the millions of people who generally have little more than a mild, passing interest in music. But being immediately accessible doesn't necessarily make something bad.

The analogy was about something that's easily accessible to someone who doesn't know much music and hasn't experienced a very wide variety of it, and things that might take more experience or knowledge to appreciate. "Milk" would fit just as well in place of "sugary cereal."

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Originally posted by mysticalninja Umm I most definitely consider ganster rap and country music. ....get off your fucking high horse.

Way to dismiss everything with a single pointless oneliner.

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