quote:

Originally posted by DJ Shibby The only escape, a sanctuary really, is to embrace a little bit of chaos in your day to day.

What do you mean, like smokin' a spliff?

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Originally posted by Trancer-X What do you mean, like smokin' a spliff?

Sure, whatever works. Weed is truly a gift that we can't ignore, especially since our species has done it for so long either directly or indirectly that our body systems have adapted specific receptors to utilize and augment the plant's natural compounds.

I was thinking more along the lines of having a little bit of randomness in your day and schedule and routine, however you might go about attaining that.

Your suggestion sounds fun though, let's do it.

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Originally posted by Lebezniatnikov If you ask me, I think you will see the overall decline of the nation-state as countries give up sovereignty to over-arching transnational entities and privatized corporations that specialize in the functions of government. Corporations like Blackwater, Aegis, Halliburton, etc. will become providers of security, welfare, healthcare, and education and will replace the state as semi-autonomous entities within an over-arching global governance system....

Some really great points in there, many of which I agree with. My problem with many of the dystopian outlooks is that they present a vast, puppet master-like totalitarian state. History has proved time and again that these states collapse relatively quickly and that this trend of corporate power is rising far quicker than political power.

The point is, if the US were to become a totalitarian state even 20 years in the future, this would mean a shocking turn in our political system, which even the dimmest of Americans would notice. A revolt, or more likely, state secession would occur and the totalitarian system would very quickly collapse.

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Lost Souls

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Originally posted by kush paintings Some really great points in there, many of which I agree with. My problem with many of the dystopian outlooks is that they present a vast, puppet master-like totalitarian state. History has proved time and again that these states collapse relatively quickly and that this trend of corporate power is rising far quicker than political power. The point is, if the US were to become a totalitarian state even 20 years in the future, this would mean a shocking turn in our political system, which even the dimmest of Americans would notice. A revolt, or more likely, state secession would occur and the totalitarian system would very quickly collapse.

The problem is, though - is that the one major point that Huxley really tried to make in Brave New World is that people can be conditioned to accept a totalitarian government without even realizing that they are living under it's rule. People will be willing to accept Big Brother just so long as their basic material needs are taken care of.

That's what I think we're seeing happen today with an increasing number of individuals making the justification for an ever encroaching, growingly totalitarian, surveillance style police state.

Last edited by Trancer-X on Oct-14-2007 at 20:12

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"A really efficient totalitarian state would be one in which the all powerful executive of political bosses and their army of managers control a population of slaves that do not have to be coerced, because they love their servitude. To make them love it is the task assigned, in present-day totalitarian states, to ministries of propaganda, newspaper editors, and school teachers..." - Aldous Huxley, Brave New World

quote:

Originally posted by kush paintings The point is, if the US were to become a totalitarian state even 20 years in the future, this would mean a shocking turn in our political system, which even the dimmest of Americans would notice. A revolt, or more likely, state secession would occur and the totalitarian system would very quickly collapse.

Unless it was under the guise of national security, i.e. another false-flag, errr, I mean terrorist attack.




Wake up Call - Watch for another 9/11-WMD experience



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_gNy4V1eAGQ

Last edited by Trancer-X on Oct-14-2007 at 20:42

You do not have a totalitarian state in the US today. Yes, there is a proliferation of spying and mass invasion of privacy, but there is still a forum for free discussion. I don't believe the US will ever reach that point where free discussion is altogether banned. I think Huxley was on to some great things, and was truly a visionary, but I do not believe a powerful state is needed to enslave people when the majority of the population already are willing to enslave themselves to corporations. Ideas need not be banned when, for example, corporations will only hire college students with economics degrees. College education becomes only a resume builder, while philosophy, sociology and the like are taken by fewer and fewer students. You don't need a government to do all of this. You simply need a society obsessed with consumerism and a strong corporate base where power is consolidated into the hands of a few elite.

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Lost Souls

One government, one currency, one religion, one leader...

""For more than a century ideological extremists at either end of the the political spectrum have seized upon well-publicized incidents ... to attack the Rockefeller family for the inordinate influence they claim we wield over American political and economic institutions. Some even believe we are part of a secret cabal working against the best interests of the United States, characterizing my family and me as 'internationalists' and of conspiring with others around the world to build a more integrated global political and economic structure - one world, if you will. If that's the charge, I stand guilty, and I am proud of it."

- David Rockefeller, "Memoirs" autobiography (2002, Random House publishers), page 405 "

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cLFBUrHPmNM

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Paul Craig Roberts, a Republican who worked in the Reagan administration, is predicting a 9-11 type of attack before the 2008 elections. If that occurs, Bush can declare martial law and begin arresting those who disagree with his foreign policy (based on Executive Orders recently issued by the Bush Administration that grant the president these powers and more.)

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Originally posted by kush paintings You do not have a totalitarian state in the US today. Yes, there is a proliferation of spying and mass invasion of privacy, but there is still a forum for free discussion. I don't believe the US will ever reach that point where free discussion is altogether banned. I think Huxley was on to some great things, and was truly a visionary, but I do not believe a powerful state is needed to enslave people when the majority of the population already are willing to enslave themselves to corporations. Ideas need not be banned when, for example, corporations will only hire college students with economics degrees. College education becomes only a resume builder, while philosophy, sociology and the like are taken by fewer and fewer students. You don't need a government to do all of this. You simply need a society obsessed with consumerism and a strong corporate base where power is consolidated into the hands of a few elite.

Sure, but that's kind of like saying, "don't worry because their totalitarian puzzle isn't fully completed yet" when in fact it's really only missing just a few small pieces.

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cLFBUrHPmNM

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"Americans think that their danger is terrorists. They don't understand that the terrorists cannot take away Habeus Corpus, the Bill of Rights, the Constitution, they can't suspend our Constitutional government, the separation of powers, they can't pick them up or shut them up or pick them up and arrest them. The terrorists are not anything like the threat that we face to the Bill of Rights and the Constitution from our own government - in the name of fighting terrorism. American's just aren't able to perceive that, or at least not enough of them are..." - Paul Craig Roberts

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Paul Craig Roberts is an economist and a nationally syndicated columnist for Creators Syndicate. He served as an Assistant Secretary of the Treasury in the Reagan Administration earning fame as the "Father of Reaganomics". He is a former editor and columnist for the Wall Street Journal, Business Week, and Scripps Howard News Service. He is a graduate of the Georgia Institute of Technology and he holds a Ph.D. from the University of Virginia. He was a post-graduate at the University of California, Berkeley, and Oxford University where he was a member of Merton College. In 1992 he received the Warren Brookes Award for Excellence in Journalism. In 1993 the Forbes Media Guide ranked him as one of the top seven journalists in the United States [1].

I don't understand some of your beliefs Trancer-x. States are more powerful than ever, since FDR's new deal created cooperative federalism. New federalism has enabled states to take on welfare (thanks to clinton, oddly enough), education, and taxes. Individuals are now closer to their local and state governments more than ever! The federal government really doesn't have the power that it used to have. You can throw all of the quotes, videos and wikipedia articles you want, but conspiracy theories aside, our federal government is giving more power to the states, so issues will be dealt with according to the local governments demographic.

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"You won a new refrigerator, great! Where you gonna put it?" - Tony Danza