Man invented the fear of global warming.

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There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio,
Than are dreamt of in your philosophy.

anyone who tries to deny that global warming isnt happening to this planet or that we didnt cause it truly is friggin stupid.

yes, we did cause global warming.

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AustralianGQ

quote:

Originally posted by AustralianGQ anyone who tries to deny that global warming isnt happening to this planet or that we didnt cause it truly is friggin stupid. yes, we did cause global warming.

If you don't edit your post with *imo* you're going to get raped by everyone.

quote:

Originally posted by jupiterone If you don't edit your post with *imo* you're going to get raped by everyone.

not by me. i agree 100%. it pisses me off immensely when people that aren't climate biologists etc are attempting to throw their opinion into the forum. a forum that they are thoroughly ill-equipped to participate in.

thus, if youre a climate expert and don't agree with the general scientific consensus, then by all means express yourself here.

otherwise, shut the fuck up.

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quote:

Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN not by me. i agree 100%. it pisses me off immensely when people that aren't climate biologists etc are attempting to throw their opinion into the forum. a forum that they are thoroughly ill-equipped to participate in. thus, if youre a climate expert and don't agree with the general scientific consensus, then by all means express yourself here. otherwise, shut the fuck up.

Obiously not, I mean, cars don't really make exhaust, just fairy dust!


Nut, I understand where you're coming from, but does this mean that if I'm not a climate scientist, I can't have an opinion? Even if I form that opinion from reading reports by climate experts?

The debate has moved so far beyond "what are we going to do to fix it" and into a debate about the debate itself that I doubt we'll ever reach a workable solution, unfortunately. It's a tragedy, and in 50-100 years we will look back and wonder why we did nothing...

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quote:

Originally posted by ******** Seplling don't demonstrate intelligence and educatoin - knowing does.

quote:

Originally posted by Clovis Obiously not, I mean, cars don't really make exhaust, just fairy dust! Nut, I understand where you're coming from, but does this mean that if I'm not a climate scientist, I can't have an opinion? Even if I form that opinion from reading reports by climate experts? The debate has moved so far beyond "what are we going to do to fix it" and into a debate about the debate itself that I doubt we'll ever reach a workable solution, unfortunately. It's a tragedy, and in 50-100 years we will look back and wonder why we did nothing...

Clovis

My reference is geared towards people who rely on a hair trigger response of global warming.

My reply was not geared towards anyone nor towards this thread. It was a generalization of the multitude of threads that have popped up over time.

I encourage people to have their own thoughts about the subject. Provoking the subject will only do good as more attention can be brought to it. The way I see it, the more educated people are on the subject.. the better the awareness. Ignorance is not bliss. It will only do more harm than good.


Non related to the clovsha comment:

The bad part of the situation is that some of the worlds oceans have already saturated in co2 (read on carbon sinks). The terrestrial component of the planet is not taking any more co2. so more of what we spew into the atmosphere is staying there instead of being absorbed by the oceans or the terrestrial biosphere. So co2 will start increasing faster than ever before.... far faster than any research/modeling has predicted.


Now when you look at global sea ice concentration:





Just form your own thoughts.

quote:

Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN not by me. i agree 100%. it pisses me off immensely when people that aren't climate biologists etc are attempting to throw their opinion into the forum. a forum that they are thoroughly ill-equipped to participate in. thus, if youre a climate expert and don't agree with the general scientific consensus, then by all means express yourself here. otherwise, shut the fuck up.

You put too much trust into the institution.

I know you are in fact capable of critical thought sometimes, but don't try to pass off your maxims as though they should apply to everyone - there are plenty of reasons to doubt scientists and "research". In fact, this reasonable skepticism is far too rare when people are presented with facts. Just because someone has "Dr." in front of their name doesn't mean they are right or that we should listen to them.

Do I understand how stupid it is when someone reads a single fucking article and automatically thinks they are able to tell others what to think? Yeah. It's stupid as shit. But do I also think that people should be allowed to think for themselves when it comes to exactly what they take in? Yeah, it's quite healthy and despairingly rare. I realize this is somewhat of a flawed adage in this case, but I'm going to have to invoke the just because I'm not a movie critic doesn't mean I can't have an opinion on the movie rule, in concept, alone. I realize that there is a very fine distinction between science and mere opinion, but in the end, science will not save the world of man - it is too far removed from humanity to do such a thing. It has its place in making us understand, but I would no sooner suck the dick off of God than I would a scientist.

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There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio,
Than are dreamt of in your philosophy.

quote:

Originally posted by Halcyon+On+On You put too much trust into the institution. I know you are in fact capable of critical thought sometimes, but don't try to pass off your maxims as though they should apply to everyone - there are plenty of reasons to doubt scientists and "research". In fact, this reasonable skepticism is far too rare when people are presented with facts. Just because someone has "Dr." in front of their name doesn't mean they are right or that we should listen to them. Do I understand how stupid it is when someone reads a single fucking article and automatically thinks they are able to tell others what to think? Yeah. It's stupid as shit. But do I also think that people should be allowed to think for themselves when it comes to exactly what they take in? Yeah, it's quite healthy and despairingly rare. I realize this is somewhat of a flawed adage in this case, but I'm going to have to invoke the just because I'm not a movie critic doesn't mean I can't have an opinion on the movie rule, in concept, alone. I realize that there is a very fine distinction between science and mere opinion, but in the end, science will not save the world of man - it is too far removed from humanity to do such a thing. It has its place in making us understand, but I would no sooner suck the dick off of God than I would a scientist.

The only drawback to your argument is that much of the current research is based off of empirical evidence and not theory.

quote:

The bad part of the situation is that some of the worlds oceans have already saturated in co2 (read on carbon sinks). The terrestrial component of the planet is not taking any more co2. so more of what we spew into the atmosphere is staying there instead of being absorbed by the oceans or the terrestrial biosphere. So co2 will start increasing faster than ever before.... far faster than any research/modeling has predicted.

Read a fantastic article on the subject a while back in the New Yorker...it said that they estimate by 2075 98% of the coral reefs in the ocean will have vanished because the absorption of excess CO2 in the air by the ocean is causing the pH of the waters to change, at a rate far too fast for marine life to adjust to.


People constantly throw out that "there have been climate swings for millions of years" argument, but its shit, of course there have, but on an evolutionary scale this time it is happening at the speed of a bullet being fired...

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quote:

Originally posted by ******** Seplling don't demonstrate intelligence and educatoin - knowing does.

quote:

Originally posted by Halcyon+On+On You put too much trust into the institution.

Perhaps.

quote:

I know you are in fact capable of critical thought sometimes, but don't try to pass off your maxims as though they should apply to everyone - there are plenty of reasons to doubt scientists and "research". In fact, this reasonable skepticism is far too rare when people are presented with facts. Just because someone has "Dr." in front of their name doesn't mean they are right or that we should listen to them.

Only sometimes? im great with critical thought until my intolerance gets the better of me, LOL. But in regards to your point; when pretty much the whole world's collective of climate specialists are saying one thing, I find it deeply DEEPLY arrogant in the extreme for people who don't have experience and/or knowledge in the climate sciences to be doubting anything. If someone has done their own research or has analysed competing ideas (and has the capacity to do so) then im all ears. But its those that ignore the mountains of evidence in favour of ideas akin to conspiracy theories that piss me off.

quote:

Do I understand how stupid it is when someone reads a single fucking article and automatically thinks they are able to tell others what to think? Yeah. It's stupid as shit. But do I also think that people should be allowed to think for themselves when it comes to exactly what they take in? Yeah, it's quite healthy and despairingly rare. I realize this is somewhat of a flawed adage in this case, but I'm going to have to invoke the just because I'm not a movie critic doesn't mean I can't have an opinion on the movie rule, in concept, alone. I realize that there is a very fine distinction between science and mere opinion, but in the end, science will not save the world of man - it is too far removed from humanity to do such a thing. It has its place in making us understand, but I would no sooner suck the dick off of God than I would a scientist.

Of course people should be allowed to have their own opinions. Just as I am free to call them stupid. But, my central contention remains, the average citizen (and I am including myself here too) does not have the knowledge, experience, or capacity to be making a case against the general consensus, and all too often people love to think of themselves on the outside looking in, and it fucks me right off.

And don't, even for a second, compare science and religion in this context. It makes absolutely zero sense. To argue science is in the "ballpark" of religion (in the context of attainable "truth") is just nonsense.

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Most events that occur today are far too complicated for ordinary people to understand and analyze technically. You need experts in that particular field to explain them to us. That is a fact. However in this age of information technology, a larger audience is exposed to these events and wants to voice its opinion. But you cannot form an informed opinion, unless you are educated in the profession that best describes these events technically.

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Originally posted by twilightki : It feels like something you'd listen to at 4 in the morning, or listen to in your car while you're going in a tunnel.

Last edited by Omega_M on Nov-15-2007 at 02:14