Classical music elitists piss me off. Even worse are the people who listen to it only to appear smarter. ******s

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Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN dont argue with the yanks nutter, they know best!

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Originally posted by Halcyon+On+On "Intelligence" is merely another projection of socialization.

No, it's not. Intelligence is a measurable characteristic of one's cognitive functionality. Historically and statistically speaking, it is typically indicative of positive socialization. It's not an arbitrary concept that has anything to do with a "projection of socialization". Intelligence is as equally measurable, and as equally important, whether you're a prominent New York yuppie or a dirt farmer in bangladesh.

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Participating in activities that might make oneself more sociable in a cultural knowledge sense might very well give the appearance of intelligence.

Chances are if you are willing to participate in a social activity that will give the impression you are intelligent, it is likely to be an activity that will actually aid your intelligence. Chess and heated political debates come to mind.

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Since intelligence, itself, is a paltry human scale of comparative, the retention of expressed socialization might very well be a form of intelligence.

This statement just makes no sense. I'm going to assume you mean that intelligence is an poor choice of comparison among people, civilizations, and cultures... well, this is just not the case.

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Also, listening to classical music doesn't make you any smarter.

Actually, it is well-documented that listening to classical music is [probably the only genre of music] that is likely to improve memory functionality, study habits, and helps to hasten thought processing.

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I'm sorry. You can harbour whatever self-delusions of intelligence and corresponding archetypes that you like, but just because it was composed by diligent, intelligent people doesn't necessarily mean that it's suddenly not just a series of organized vibrations.

I suggest you take a look into it before you accuse me of being delusional and having "corresponding archetypes" to intelligence (whichever they may be... I'm not really sure what an archetype to intelligence could be.)


FYI, check out The Mozart Effect:
The Mozart effect refers to disputed scientific studies that test a theory suggesting that classical music increases brain activity more positively than other kinds of music,[1] and that listening to certain kinds of complex music may induce a short-lived (fifteen minute) improvement in the performance of certain kinds of mental tasks known as "spatio-temporal reasoning".
[Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mozart_effect]

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Originally posted by Fibonacci No, it's not. Intelligence is a measurable characteristic of one's cognitive functionality. Historically and statistically speaking, it is typically indicative of positive socialization. It's not an arbitrary concept that has anything to do with a "projection of socialization". Intelligence is as equally measurable, and as equally important, whether you're a prominent New York yuppie or a dirt farmer in bangladesh.

Yes, cognitive functionality WITHIN the realm of approved knowledge. But approved by whom? Who makes the tests? I think the answer is a social institution or construct of some sort. Are you really all sorts of hot for IQ tests? Do you honestly think they are an effective representation of one's ability to function cognitively? Like, as a universal rule? hm.

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Chances are if you are willing to participate in a social activity that will give the impression you are intelligent, it is likely to be an activity that will actually aid your intelligence. Chess and heated political debates come to mind.

Here we get into the music theory you're such a huge fan of. Yes, willing participation to socialize in a supposed "intelligent" setting may very well make you appear smart - if you want it to. What you might very well gain in expressed "intelligent" patterns *is* something you gain from socializing in the first place. Assuming you are participating in socially-approved (that's not even all that important) activities, there is a transmission of socialized knowledge and practice. You are imitating a projection of sociability.

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This statement just makes no sense. I'm going to assume you mean that intelligence is an poor choice of comparison among people, civilizations, and cultures... well, this is just not the case.

Ah, it was a bit of a clause.

Intelligence is a very human scale. As far as we know, we are the most intelligent beings we know of. I suppose it all depends on how much you think this says about us. Every creature operates within its own sphere of knowledge or habit, as it would be - and it's reasonably subjective how you view your own species. Human intelligence isn't a poor comparison amongst humans, but suppose one would describe a dolphin as "intelligent". It's not too far-fetched. But can a dolphin be socialized to the point of exprssing very specific human knowledge? Can a dolphin do calculus? Can a dolphin paint a picture? Can a dolphin compose classical music? They may very well express several traits that are quite conducive with sociability and intelligence in a human sense, but our methods of determination don't indicate their supposed "intelligence" is really the same kind. Is it better? Is it worse? Define your terms. They survive just fine. It is we who seem to be the most discontent with mere survival.

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Actually, it is well-documented that listening to classical music is [probably the only genre of music] that is likely to improve memory functionality, study habits, and helps to hasten thought processing. I suggest you take a look into it before you accuse me of being delusional and having "corresponding archetypes" to intelligence (whichever they may be... I'm not really sure what an archetype to intelligence could be.)

By "corresponding archetypes", I meant what social sense people imagine when "intelligence" comes to mind. I would say most people regard the well-bred, the well-red, the well-travelled, pipe-smoking, classical music-listening elite to be beacons of intelligence. Is this necessarily true? No, not necessarily. But the necessity of an image has sparse prevented people from holding it to be a projection of the generalization. And this is where the appearance of sociability comes into play - after all, since intelligence is a mere comparative, there must be a judge and a witness to the comparison, no?

"Good" habits are indeed associated with intelligence, but are they definitive of it? Who can really say? Whatever works is smart and whatever's smart, works. Is it the effect or the means? Come to think of it, what, truly, is the necessity of intelligence? I think the study represents only an opening of the mind - or perhaps a closing? It is a pattern, a structure - a construct of a prodigious man some few hundred years ago that people have jerked off over ever since. Mozart's music changed the world because people were willing to relate it to their society - to accept it, to assimilate it, to discard him. And so the same society that sets the standards for what is intelligent and what is not can set the standards for which its very own definition can be self-fulfilled. Ahh.

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FYI, check out The Mozart Effect: The Mozart effect refers to disputed scientific studies that test a theory suggesting that classical music increases brain activity more positively than other kinds of music,[1] and that listening to certain kinds of complex music may induce a short-lived (fifteen minute) improvement in the performance of certain kinds of mental tasks known as "spatio-temporal reasoning". [Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mozart_effect]

Yeah, it seems disputed because it seems barely science. Cognitive functionality within the spheres of human intelligence does not make for effective progression - the push on what we know, the stress and the destruction of petterns - that is where true intelligence lies.

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There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio,
Than are dreamt of in your philosophy.

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Originally posted by Fibonacci Actually, it is well-documented that listening to classical music is [probably the only genre of music] that is likely to improve memory functionality, study habits, and helps to hasten thought processing.

i don't care what the "studies" say, there is nothing inherent about any form of music that achieves this ^^ better than any other form. indeed, classical is as diverse as EDM, so i think the studies are bullshit.

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Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN i don't care what the "studies" say, there is nothing inherent about any form of music that achieves this ^^ better than any other form. indeed, classical is as diverse as EDM, so i think the studies are bullshit.

Yeah, or they're focused and funded by rich old white people who are so high on preserving their "cultural heritage", it doesn't really matter whether the study is bunk or not, as long as "experts" determine that people are "smarter" by listening to music.

___________________
There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio,
Than are dreamt of in your philosophy.

I feel smarter every time I take a huge dump. It's also arousing.

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Originally posted by Fibonacci Actually, it is well-documented that listening to classical music is [probably the only genre of music] that is likely to improve memory functionality, study habits, and helps to hasten thought processing.

If anything, good rap music would be better. You may think that sounds silly, but freestyling aint easy. Not only do you have to be quick with words, and good with using words, but you also have to manipulate said words to create a rhythm that people can move to. In order to do that you have to have a good vocabulary while also simultaneously pulling off a beat that flows to a background melody. Classical music I dont think compares to the number of dimensions of rap music in terms of "memory functionality" and "thought processing."

Of course you may think of the standard, generic, tired as shit mainstream rap music that annoys the hell out of most people, but there is some rap out there that is nothing but pure poetry going along to a beat. Regardless, I dont think its possible whatsoever to label a person's intelligence according to their musical tastes.

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Originally posted by jennypie I feel smarter every time I take a huge dump. It's also arousing.

you might feel smarter, but after a huge dump you are actually dumber, shit for brains...

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Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN you might feel smarter, but after a huge dump you are actually dumber, shit for brains...

haha, awesome.

___________________
There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio,
Than are dreamt of in your philosophy.

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Originally posted by pkcRAISTLIN you might feel smarter, but after a huge dump you are actually dumber, shit for brains...

LoL, I like your style.

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Originally posted by MrJiveBoJingles Something I find annoying: "I don't like or do [y]. Only a stupid person could possibly like or want to do [y]. Therefore I must be smart."

they're idiots because everyone knows a false positive is not the same as a contrapositive.


Itchy