quote:

Originally posted by Moral Hazard It think you hit the nail on the head right there. Remember, Islam is only 1400 years old... think about Christianity at 1300-1400 years of age, it had some messed up problems too; the top positions in the Orthodox church were sold to the highest bidder, there were contraversies over who the rightful pope was, the Spanish Inquisition, Pope Alexander VI having children and then giving away church lands to his children, selling forgiveness, etc. all hot on the heels of the final crusade. It's probable that Islam will sort itself out in time, unfortunately, in the mean time we have an adolesent, evangelical, medieval religion armed with modern weapons.

Yeah man, it's totally true.

PLUS we are genetically "coded" to want to reproduce at a young age for survival... our current culture instills it in us that this is not acceptable.

I don't really like kids, for any purpose, so I guess I'm a biased source here... just my 2 cents.

To be fair, even if Mohammed did marry a 6-year-old kid, I'm sure every religion has rules and laws that are now rejected by most sane people (well, as sane as religious people can get!!)

And at the same time, every religion probably has archane laws that nutters use to justify their crazy actions, like this particular Afghan with a penchant for young girls, or the psycho who claims God told him to invade another country and kill kill KILL

quote:

Originally posted by George Smiley And at the same time, every religion probably has archane laws that nutters use to justify their crazy actions, like this particular Afghan with a penchant for young girls, or the psycho who claims God told him to invade another country and kill kill KILL

True, Look at those sick ass focks from that morman sect, kidnapping that little girl ..... sad in the US no less {double }

quote:

Originally posted by Moral Hazard So Mohammed's wife Aisha, I suppose she was mature enough at the ripe of age of 6?

Aisha was the daughter of Abu Bakr, one of the first few converts to Islam, a powerful Quraish tribesman, and a long time companion of the Prophet. In that day and age, this wasn't an uncommon cultural practice amongst the semetic people at all, and it wasn't just limited to the Arab world (it extends to the West and much of Asia as well). The average life expectancy wasn't anywhere near what it is in the post industrial world, so it's wasn't an unsual or weird cultural practice. Aisha was 6 when she was married to Muhammad, but stil lived with her parents, and the marriage was consumated when she was 9 according to Hadith transcribed by Abu Bukhari and a few others. 9 to 11 was generally the age when females in at least in that day and age, climatic conditions, and region of the world hit puberty. According to the same historical records, they were both also quite fond of each and the marriage was a happy one, as odd as it sound from our post-modern cultural perspective. Aisha was also one of Islam most important scholars and advisors. Pedophiles generally don't marry their victim, nor is there mutual affection or a long lasting marriage.

Having said that, yes it's really weird to me as I'm fairly Westernized, having been born in the US and spend most of my life here. Similiarly, to conservative eastern cultures, there quite a number of western cultural norms that are equally repulsive. From their cultural reference, "scantily" clad women who're not virigins before marriage are analagous to whores. And by their cultural norms, anything attire revealing a fair bit of skin qualifies as scantily clad. Now, a statement like that would piss most of us the fuck off. It's judgemental in the sense that they/you are applying their/your cultural norms and expectations to them/you. Am I saying I agree with eigther one? Not really, because I choose not to be judgemental in that regard, especially considering the contrasting differences in how different cultures (and in different times periods) view sex, love, marriage, and other aspects of human relations and social customs. Being fairly exposed to a diverse cultural, national, social, and ethical norms, I choose to ignore my socialy and culturaly conditioned reactions.

So I guess if you're going to call them pedopihles, as legitimate as it seems in our cultural reference, in all fairness you'll have to call western women whores too and westerners in general sexually driven animals.

Havind lived in both the West and the East [US (South Carolina, Pennsylvainia, Illinois, California, and Texas), Saudi Arabia, and Pakistan], I've heard a fair bit of what I consider bullshit judgemental statements reflecting complete ignorance in all places about various peoples and cultures. That's despite the fact that I myself have a Western cultural bias as that's where I've mostly lived and am used to. So judgements and labels like whore or pedophile are becomes fairly repulsive. If some Arab or South Asian were to call my girlfriend a Jewish western whore, I'd probably smack the fuck out of him, because not only is it offensive but it get's kinda personal. Perhaps you should think twice before jumping to conclusions and imposing cultural evaluation out of context and ignorance.

And no, what we consider under age marriage or pedophelia isn't the norm there, and is a dying cultural practice in more rural areas. And it certainly isn't limited to Afghanistan or "Muslim" countries.

___________________
"The Greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge." -Stephen Hawking
"First they came for the communists, and I did not speak out— because I was not a communist;
Then they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out— because I was not a socialist;
Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out— because I was not a trade unionist;
Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out— because I was not a Jew;
Then they came for me— and there was no one left to speak out for me." -Martin Niemöller

how did you like pakistan? tell me the good and the bad lol

quote:

Originally posted by Noober how did you like pakistan? tell me the good and the bad lol

Not really. I'm afraid the "good" would be limited to the food mostly lol.

EDIT: Well, to be fair, there's a number of other things. Unfortunately, they don't really apply to my experience there.

___________________
"The Greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge." -Stephen Hawking
"First they came for the communists, and I did not speak out— because I was not a communist;
Then they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out— because I was not a socialist;
Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out— because I was not a trade unionist;
Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out— because I was not a Jew;
Then they came for me— and there was no one left to speak out for me." -Martin Niemöller

Last edited by shaolin_Z on Dec-23-2007 at 00:37

stupid thread.... cant generalize what 1.6 billion Muslims believe by this photograph... end of story.

true