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| quote: | Originally posted by the_jerk
Like I said before, I am not a Patriots fan. But anyone that says the Patriots perfect season is somehow tarnished because of spygate doesn't know the first thing about football.
Every team attempts to "spy" on the other during games to figure out what audibles or play signals are. It happens at every level - high school, college and of course professional. Look at most coaches when they call in plays - they put the play sheet over their mouth. |
Page 105 of the 2007 NFL Game Operations Manual states, "No video recording devices of any kind are permitted to be in use in the coaches' booth, on the field, or in the locker room during the game...All video shooting locations must be enclosed on all sides with a roof overhead. The rules clearly stipulate that ...any communications or information-gathering equipment, other than Polaroid-type cameras or field telephones, shall be prohibited...that might aid a team during the playing of a game."
Patriots’ staff were cheating and Eric Mangini knew it as he was the Patriots Defensive Backs coach from 2000-2004 and then Defensive Coordinator in 2005. He was a part of Belicheck's "sign-stealing surveillance tactics and he shared the dirty little secret with members of the Jets' organization" and was just hoping to catch them in the act. Luckily, he succeeded.
IMHO, covering your mouth with a play sheet and having a staff member video tape the hand signals from the Jets' defensive coaches on the sideline is not an accurate comparison for several reasons. Sending a staff member with a video recorder with this intention indicates that this was all pre-planned, whereas reading someone's lips across the field when calling a play doesn't suggest any pre-planning with the intent to gain from it at half time when they can make adjustments, etc. (I'm not saying that reading lips its not cheating either). Secondly, if it was just about reading lips then it would give both teams equal opportunity to try and read lips, however this was not the case. When Patriot video assistant, Matt Estrella, was caught while trying to take the video into the locker room just before half time, he resisted giving it up until it was finally taken out of his possession. An animated discussion ensued that involved league security and it lasted more than an hour when it became so heated that New Jersey state troopers were summoned as a precaution (Daily News, Dec 10, 2007). Obviously, Estrella didn’t want the Jets or the NFL to see what he was doing, otherwise he would have handed it over without any issue. It's my experience that people who have nothing to hide will hide nothing for obvious reasons.
As for Belicheck, I also don't buy into the idea that he didn't clearly understand and "misinterpreted the rules." Anyone in the NFL who is a coach, player, or even refs., should know the rules and be accountable for following them. Belicheck stated that he "believed that if footage collected was not used during the game, then its collection was legal," whereas the rules CLEARLY state that "...any communications or information-gathering equipment, other than Polaroid-type cameras or field telephones, shall be prohibited at any time as it may aid a team during the playing of a game." I still can’t see where his confusion or misunderstanding is with this rule.
Finally, if you are implying that just because most teams attempt to spy (whether it be HS, college, NFL) makes it okay or acceptable, that's just ridiculous IMHO. I will never buy into the maxims of "well, if you can't beat 'em then join 'em." or "everyone attempts to spy," then that makes it acceptable. Granted I will never coach a football team, but I refuse to subscribe to this form of reasoning that somehow rationalizes cheating.
Obviously we will always disagree on this issue. My opinion about how the Pat's image will always be tarnished in my mind is just simply my opinion. But saying that we "don't know anything about football" is taking it a bit far as we all have a right to an opinion and many who hold this same opinion have been or are currently part of the NFL, including the NFL Commisioner who imposed fines for their actions. With that being said, have a great time watching the game and a wonderful weekend!
Last edited by KrisSC2000 on Feb-01-2008 at 22:35
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