I read up on audio watermarking a while back, it's interesting stuff. Apparently it uses the last 1 or 2 bits (I believe this was for 16 bit audio) of information, so it's way below the level of the other audio. And apparently it's possible to extract/ determine the watermark, even if you record the audio using external devices. I'd say if the signal is processed/effected enough the watermark would disappear.

I'd assume the Vengeance CDs would just have one of these extremely low-level watermarks in there somewhere (rather than throughout the whole CD), since they figure that anyone torrenting it wouldn't go through every single millisecond of sound looking for a waveform which is ever so slightly different...if you'd even notice it...but I can well imagine they'd be able to trace it to the person who bought it. The technology is available. Of course, they could be bluffing.

Also, it seems the Future House series is different to their other products, which (I believe) don't have these conditions. Their other products are straight sample CDs, while these seem to be sets of sounds which fit together, and could potentially be used straight up to create a song - that is, just add vocals and bingo! Instant song! But yeah, it seems odd that they'd apply this condition, I wonder why they released these CDs if people aren't allowed to use the sounds without asking for permission...

quote:

Originally posted by derail I wonder why they released these CDs if people aren't allowed to use the sounds without asking for permission...

You are allowed to use the sounds any where you like, as long as you provide a proof of purchase. In this case a receipt or any proof of transaction which has your name on it, and the original copy of the cd. Not a cracked version.. You basically have to be the one who bought it. If you're using it in your production you are the person who's responsible for being the owner of the sample cd . It's not like you can borrow a synth from a friend and use it in your productions. When it comes to commercial sample cd's that's how it works. And if you're using your friends sample cd you're breaching the copyright agreement as we speak. That's all there is to it. This goes for most sample cd's sold for music creation since the beginning of it all. Unless stated otherwise on the sample cd itself.. There isn't anything special to argue about here, and the guys at vengeance did what everyone else is doing.. So if you're not the original owner, and say you made a hit that sold thousands of records, and made lot's of money. And the sample is from some sample cd that you do not have.. Than there is a chance you might be sued.. There are other variables involved here.. You can mangle the sound and apply your post processing, but sometimes they will sue you casue they have proof that it did come from their sample cd or whatever the source is.It get''s a little more involving at this time,But think of a sample cd as sampling from other artist, and you're only giving permission to use their material if you paid them, and are the original owner of the cd.. Sample cd in this case. If you are not than this is a copyright breach, and your'e exposing yourself to being sued. But no one cares if some bedroom producer uses it in their tracks... the problem becomes serious when real money is involved. Try sampling some known artist and let's say you have a hit... Most likely you will have a lawyer calling you shortly....

If this (from the OP) is an exact quote you're wrong. This paragraph does not implicate an invoice is sufficient at all. Common sense would say so, but from a legal perspective that would not be enough.

quote:

"You are not allowed to use the sounds for any commercial music production, jingle, broadcasted music, remixes and any other commercial purposes, without explicit permission."

Maybe the same license tells you you're allowed to use them in any type of productions IF you paid for the product.

I'm overthinking of building an mp3 promotion system with watermarking for myself and perhaps commercial use. It's not that hard .

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quote:

If less is more think about how much more more would be. -Frasier

Last edited by Storyteller on May-01-2009 at 21:57

quote:

Originally posted by david.michael Yeah, why play someone else's piano, when a real musician builds their own?

pretty wicked analogy btw

quote:

Originally posted by david.michael Yeah, why play someone else's piano, when a real musician builds their own?

If you can build punchy kick drums from the ground up, I would be impressed.

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quote:

Originally posted by dj_alfi change your avatar for fucks sake.

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Originally posted by Rawbert Taken from the license to Vengeance Future House vol1: "You are not allowed to use the sounds for any commercial music production, jingle, broadcasted music, remixes and any other commercial purposes, without explicit permission." what do you guys think about that?.... www.myspace.com/roblepitch

What if I dont have the phone or the internet to ask them for 'permission'?

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**** Off Im mixing

How about "fuck you i'll use the samples how ever I want"?

I have a song that is played, it has star trek and beavis and butthead samples in it...ive yet to be contacted.

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Originally posted by Beatflux If you can build punchy kick drums from the ground up, I would be impressed.

Really? I was under the impression, from what I have read and seen, that trance music uses almost exclusively nothing but synth kicks. Atleast, Ive not once heard a real bass drum in a trance track before.

Anyhow, its not that hard to make percussion in a synth. Fruity Kicker + FX = nice kick. But I could see why samples are used...its easy. Even I use samples for some things, because I want to actually copy someone elses drums [actual drum kits], synth percussion imho are crap in jungle and dnb tracks, in trance however i didn't think it mattered ^^

Oh fuck, I said something was easy, here goes another DJ RANN/Subtle flamewar....

DJDIRTY: Ive used the Amen Break from the Winstons, the most sampled sound in music, no one has called me. No one called any of the last 20 years worth of artists who used it. Because you have to remember not every artist cares. If they sold their shit to some obscure label, they might have trouble. But in general I find no one cares. Ive used samples cut directly from movies made the same year of the song and set them out and no one has said anything.

As for being famous, do you really think that applies to anyone on this forum? I doubt DJ RANN or RichieV are going to make the next Robert Miles - Children

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dig out the grout expose the pest to take it out without the rest

they will attest my patients restorations from the best

i'm from the west i'm not an acmeist only the alchemist

Last edited by cronodevir on May-02-2009 at 04:32

"Nothing but synth kicks?"

you gotta be joking

___________________
Sequencers: FL Studio 9XXL & Reason 3.
Main Synth Bass GTs - Pro-53, V-Station, Sytrus, Subtractor, Trilian, Blue, Sylenth & Z3ta.
Main Synth Lead/Pad GTs - Z3ta, Sytrus, Sylenth, Vangard, Albino & Nexus.
Main FXs GTs - Waves Plugins, Soundtoys, Volcano, FL Native FX.
Hardware - Truths, Echo Audiofire, Virus Snow, & Novation Xio Midi-Synth.

quote:

Originally posted by cronodevir Anyhow, its not that hard to make percussion in a synth. Fruity Kicker + FX = nice kick.

Do you have an example?

The synth kicks I've made don't sound punchy enough to me.

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quote:

Originally posted by dj_alfi change your avatar for fucks sake.

Well If that aren't punchy enough that is your personal preference. Some people say software synths aren't full enough, but many people still use software synths. I personally don't make kicks because I don't like trance kicks. But how do you think those sample CDs make their kicks? They make a bunch of synth kicks [like 30 for hardstyle kicks, like 10-15 for trancy ones or so] and layer them all at once and sample them. I know a few people that do that themselves too.

I got a whole folder full of psy kicks, and nearly every single one is synth only. Also some people [unfortunately] make their own snares for DNB tracks also. So you get this big phat bang with what sounds like a noise filter on it. You also have some "purists" out there that, for instance, use only FM8 for every single sound in their song, percs and all.

Infact Ive actually made a hardstyle kick before, but I used a bunch of synth kicks i think a sample or two and an AK47 sample..lol Want to hear it?

___________________
i'm the alchemist without the cyst without a doubt out of the mist
dig out the grout expose the pest to take it out without the rest

they will attest my patients restorations from the best

i'm from the west i'm not an acmeist only the alchemist

Last edited by cronodevir on May-02-2009 at 07:35

quote:

Originally posted by Storyteller If this (from the OP) is an exact quote you're wrong. This paragraph does not implicate an invoice is sufficient at all. Common sense would say so, but from a legal perspective that would not be enough. Maybe the same license tells you you're allowed to use them in any type of productions IF you paid for the product.

nope...

from the license:

You can use the Sounds in any type of non commercial music production. You may modify the sounds to your need.
You are not allowed to use the sounds for any commercial music production, jingle, broadcasted music, remixes and any other
commercial purposes, without explicit permission.

www.myspace.com/roblepitch

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