you couldnt lay of could you lol.

quote:

Originally posted by cryophonik Apparently I'm not using my ears, then. No offense, but that kick sounds pretty much run-of-the-mill to me. Not that that's a bad thing, mind you. I think that far too many people obsess over their kick to the point that they lose focus on what really matters to the listener (i.e., solid songwriting and a good overall mix). I'm not implying that you do that, Richard, but I see it happen far too often - producers and commenters obsessing over the kick drum in a song that has very little to offer musically. As far as that song goes, I'd suggest that the reason it sounds good is a result of the overall mix and the fact that the kick doesn't take up too much of it. In other words, it's not buried to the point where it has no character, but it's also not so huge as to attract attention to itself and exposing any flaws in its character or how well this particular kick works in the mix. Just my 2c.

Honestly Dave that kick to me is heaven - a nice rub up against a sort of lower mid valve 'wall' coupled with nice deep low sonics and at the same time sounding full yet not taking too much freq.

In the main I use Cubase 5 EQ, and I've seen many debates that one EQ is the same as any other, but I guess I'm comming to a semi serious conclusion that one EQ is not the same as another.

Anyone here that can mimick the kick in that track for me?
I tried ripping it last night but it's never isolated.

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quote:

Originally posted by sonicboom you couldnt lay of could you lol.

No I am serious, regardless how u call it, huge part of tracks impact is mixing and processing. As others mentioned, the interaction with other components is key and determines the result

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quote:

Originally posted by Richard Butler I've got WA minimal Tech and the most recent minimal pack too. Thing is I've said what I'm about to say before, but last time people did'nt get what I mean; > Listening close to some good recent pro releases, the kicks are MUCH better and very different sounding to any WA kicks. As to layering and tweaking - I'm an obsessive and do this endlesly - for hours per session.

but thats just it

A kick on its own is just that - a kick

It what goes around it, how the bassline is structured, the sub interaction, the bass timbre - believe me most of these guys are using the samples like the rest of us...they simply wouldnt have the time to be fannying around making their own kicks

I feel your frustration, i spend a fair amount of time selecting kicks
But i used to spend a lot more time before....i realised my kick decay was too long and not fitting in with the bassline and other percussion

its the sum of the parts what makes it sound pro, thats where the pro guys comes thru

p.s. dont forget the mazzterrrrrrrrrringggggggggggggggggg
p.p.s try the Wave Alchemy Drum Tools pack, loads of quality kicks in that one to fit different sounds

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Originally posted by Raphie No I am serious, regardless how u call it, huge part of tracks impact is mixing and processing. As others mentioned, the interaction with other components is key and determines the result

I totally agree.

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quote:

Originally posted by cryophonik Apparently I'm not using my ears, then. No offense, but that kick sounds pretty much run-of-the-mill to me. Not that that's a bad thing, mind you. I think that far too many people obsess over their kick to the point that they lose focus on what really matters to the listener (i.e., solid songwriting and a good overall mix). I'm not implying that you do that, Richard, but I see it happen far too often - producers and commenters obsessing over the kick drum in a song that has very little to offer musically. As far as that song goes, I'd suggest that the reason it sounds good is a result of the overall mix and the fact that the kick doesn't take up too much of it. In other words, it's not buried to the point where it has no character, but it's also not so huge as to attract attention to itself and exposing any flaws in its character or how well this particular kick works in the mix. Just my 2c.

my 2 cents:

I agree with cryo Richard, I also tend to spend a lot of time auditioning the right sample, but from my experience a "pro" kick, is more of a consequence of a sum of factors (arrangement, space between elements, Eq, compression, white noise, layering) all play an important roll. I think choosing the correct sample kick is only the foundation of the final result.

edit; ADSR adjustments too.

The packs you have are awesome, its not really the kick youre having a problem with its the sounds around it.

quote:

Originally posted by evo8 p.p.s try the Wave Alchemy Drum Tools pack, loads of quality kicks in that one to fit different sounds

Thanks for your thoughts. I've got this pack btw! It's alrightish, but not good enough.

MISE and RAPHIE - I spend vast amounts of time mixing and sound selecting. It's a shame we don't meet each other so we would have more of a handle on one another. Trust me I'm the fussiest most OCD person when it comes to these things.

I've been reducing the decay and release on kicks for a long time.

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why not do the following, just give us a samplepack of kick, clap, hh/loop, bassline(s) with individual unprocessed loops of 4 or 16 bars and let some people have a go with it.

Listen what they come back with and if you like what you hear, if one is close to what you like, we can then discuss how he got there?

It's probably just a "aha" moment

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quote:

Originally posted by Richard Butler Thanks for your thoughts. I've got this pack btw! It's alrightish, but not good enough. MISE and RAPHIE - I spend vast amounts of time mixing and sound selecting. It's a shame we don't meet each other so we would have more of a handle on one another. Trust me I'm the fussiest most OCD person when it comes to these things. I've been reducing the decay and release on kicks for a long time.

hah, ye, I an dam OCD too, in those cases when obsessed with the kick, I would work with other parts of the mix and return to it afterwards, with a "fresh" perspective. adding the final spicing more towards the end of the mix.

Is incredible how things sound different when ones get used to..

quote:

Originally posted by Raphie why not do the following, just give us a samplepack of kick, clap, hh/loop, bassline(s) with individual unprocessed loops of 4 or 16 bars and let some people have a go with it. Listen what they come back with and if you like what you hear, if one is close to what you like, we can then discuss how he got there? It's probably just a "aha" moment

The kicks I'm after like in the track I posted here are most deffo using particualr compressors, which I strongly suspect are dare I say this, analogue. I'm more than happy to be prepared to be proven wrong.

See if you can make a kick like the one in the track here maybe. I'll then buy it off ya for 5 euros!

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I think the kick on it's own will sound very different than how you experience it now it the mix. That's my point, it's the interaction

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