You know whats a real shame? People so stuborn in there beliefs that they classifiy anyone who doesnt agree with them as n00bs, or rookies or whatever. I'm a big proggressive fan don't get me wrong, but saying stuff like that is just ignorant. I also like Ian Van Dahl, and rapture, am I a noob now? There was a poll here recently wee 12 percent of the people said they coudnt stand it, and another 20 percent said they were indifrent are all these people n00bs too? I'm sorry for the rant, but I am soo sick of people blasting genres that they don't like, or blasting people for not listening to a certain type of music. So open your minds and loose the arrogonce please.

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Originally posted by TranceGiant "ADVANCE" suggests that Progressive is the ultimate goal, the highest and best genre, the thing we should all reach to eventually. And I disagree, not because i dislike prog (the contrary is the case) but because i wont accept such a biased and intolerant view on the subject. As long as its not OBVIOUSLY and totally commercial music (with the dollars, not the spirit as a background for production) every music is equal to me. Its all a piece of art waiting to be either hated or loved by the listeners. No such thing as Level A and level B music. Just wanted to add that to the discussion

good point, i view this situation in the same way.

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Originally posted by TranceGiant "ADVANCE" suggests that Progressive is the ultimate goal, the highest and best genre, the thing we should all reach to eventually. And I disagree, not because i dislike prog (the contrary is the case) but because i wont accept such a biased and intolerant view on the subject. As long as its not OBVIOUSLY and totally commercial music (with the dollars, not the spirit as a background for production) every music is equal to me. Its all a piece of art waiting to be either hated or loved by the listeners. No such thing as Level A and level B music. Just wanted to add that to the discussion

Yea i agree with you 100% accept about the commercial comments, I'm totally sick of those too, every single musician in the world wants to have success, of course there all gonna say they do it for the music, but you and I both know that there always thinking about the cash. Otherwise why would the famous djs charge so much for 1 night? Besides unless you can find the artist saying he did a track solely to sell records how can you prove thats why he made the track? He may just have "less advanced tastes" or be "totally cheesy", or he may like the music, and may have a group of people who like it too.

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Originally posted by TranceSeeker You all blame that its fucking crap etc. There were so many thread about cheesy tracks etc. You laughing out people because they like Ian van Dahl etc... Everyone does here dont pretend you didn't, I did too. But think about this: You blame them because they are n00bs to trance, they start to listen to it, they like it very much, JUST BECAUSE THEY DONT KNOW BETTER, it all has to grow onto them over a period of months, years before they really know what is good. But lets go back too the progressive haters now. Well people who like progressive think JUST THE SAME WAY ABOUT YOU GUYS, yeah you and you who read this thread. U JUST DONT KNOW ANY BETTER, you like hard(trance) etc....because u'r a rookie to trance, not a n00b but a rook (no offence to anyone here). You're not open for progressive just as people who listen to dance and cheese are not YET open for "real trance" Just keep in mind we think exactly the same about you guys, like you guys think about people who listen to cheesy tracks. Well by saying this U maybe got the point what I'm trying to say. You laugh with people who like cheese, progressive fans laugh exactly the same with you. Now u know how it feels... One day u will maybe understand what im saying.... Stand still for a second to what I said and try to place you in a progressive fan. No flame here I think I made a great point here so intelligent replies are welcome, don't talk bullshit now.

best words...ive heard this year on this board...I AGREE WIT U TOTALLY.....PROGRESSIVE is the future for all people deep into the realms of trance...it is the next stepping stone for me...ive moved away from all that uplifting cheese fest..and im more into the chill trancey...heading into progressive. I checked out dave seaman.. rennaissance..and i fell in love with it. I WAS tired of looking for sumthin new that had the cuttin edge i was looking for ALA revolution by tiesto.I LISTENED TO the rennaissance mix..and i knew this was my new style... I ALSO LISTENED to ANTHONY PAPPA - RESOLUTION ..great cd..trak 2 on disc 2 sounds like a high tek version of glad i ate her by cass and slide..very chill and moody and tight sounds..IM LOOKING for the next level..and im there..ITS ME..ive stayed with trance for a long time..but me hearing trance anthems wont cut it anymore..SO I SWITCH BACK AND FORTH..Im listening to ISOS3..trance at its best.and its boundary before progressive......ITS ALL A CHAIN...u are moving forward..MY .02

Last edited by speedracer_mec on Aug-24-2002 at 02:11

I totally agree with tranceseeker i am an example of his idea myself.. i was introduce into the whole elctronica genre somthing like 3 or 4 years ago when i started i strted with atb , darude and stuff like that , which now i would laugh on ppl listening to them and artists witht their style cuz i am musically mature in the electronica genre .. after i grew up a bit i started listening to tiesto pvd armin and the "mint" trance tracks at that time usually were uplifting ones till two or threee months b4 the release of deep dish GU i started listening to some prog tunes hereand there that i totally disgusted at the begining and couldnt understand how a producer would have the guts to release a tune so boring for the people to listen to till i got the deep dish gu album and since then i am addicted to the likes of Sander kleinenberg , Sasha , Digweed , moshic and holden . But i would disagree with tranceseeker in one thing that what he is saying is not a "rule" some people might find psychadellic as the second stage or techno as the second but for sure trance is the first step into electronica and it can never be the last . That doesnt mean that now i dont listen to trance no i do but not any kind of trance only the low bpm ones like carrera 2 , open ur eyes , stuff like that ...
thats it !! hope i made my point

i respect all types of electronic music, wether it be techno, trance, house, electronica, ambient, etc etc etc

but omg, progressive is so boring. i don't see how anyone can dance to progressive 8 hours into the nite. i gave it a chance, and i can HONESTLY say that i hate progressive

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some great posts here and it seems that this'll be a peaceful discussion for once! but i'm curious, what do you guys listen for in a progressive track? personally, i get bored sometimes at a club because while it may have a groovy bassline or wuteva, there's minimal melody for me to follow and no buildups that gets me going. clearly, i'm a die-hard hard trance fan, but yea, enlighten me fellas.

sidenote: while i can't stand hours on end of progressive, i believe a set moving from progressive to hard is fawkin' AWESOME! that's my style anyway...

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i love the relaxing feel of progressive.

In terms of Dance Music is listen to basically anything..
from Lasgo to Ferry to James Holden to Sasha to Steve Lawler...

Obviously I started with more of the Lasgo-type stuff a few years ago...then I heard a few gems like Art of Trance - Madagascar (Ferry Corsten Remix) and started to move towards Ibiza/Uplifting Trance, then into some Epic. After that I started to like more and more hardtrance like Flutlicht (OMG Expander is amazing) and Dumonde.

All this time I have still loved all other genres of dance music, from chillout to house to breakbeat (particularly Hybrid), but trance has always been my main interest.

And recently I've been getting more and more into Progressive. A track that really helps bridge the gap into the deeper, even more intense stuff is Cass & Slide - Perception (Vocal Mix).

And now I love all good Prog tunes.

I think maybe how deep and 'underground' you get in dance music depends on how much time you spend on it and how intense you become. Obviously to get into any of the heavier stuff (and 'proper' trance is included) you gonna need to have an open-mind. Most people instantly think, 'where's the pretty vocals' and one of my friends said the noises sounds 'scary and like they're trying to put you in a trance' well.. nah-dah.. y do u like it's called that.

I still listen to all genres though... just in different proportions. And I do not get embarrassed when I say I still listen to 'cheese'. In fact, I listen to more cheese in other genres of music than in trance cause I haven't gone very deep with them yet.

I'd just like to end by saying ... I LIKE LASGO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I LIKE LASGO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Let me start off with this I started off with trance after hearing Trance Nation America Disc 1 (progressive IMO). Ive been through the phases of trance, "cheese" mainstream trance, hard trance, progressive trance, deeper progressive trance/house.

I feel that in sayin people advance from cheese to trance maybe to hard then to progressive is very nicely put but not an accurate way of saying that people go through music phases. I believe we all go through phases we get addicted to music say trance. We listen to it all the time its great. However as time goes by we began to get sick of it it becomes too monotonous in our lives so we go searching for something else something to break this one track music habit. It is this causes the switch up in sub genres.

Alot of times it does go the way of the cheese,trance, hard, progressive (CTHP for now on). Why is this? Simple. How do u combat heat? With cold, something cooler. Too dry add sumthin with water. The opposites. We need variety in our lives. As music fans being enlightened we tend to get stuck on one for a while but then turn to another then another.

We go through these cycles and we learn more about the music which is a postive thing. After covering a good bit of the trance spectrum you might learn to appreciate it all for what it is. This is where u can listen to some Dumonde after chilling out to Sasha. Or compiling a mix cd with the likes of Ian Van Dahl, Fluchtlicht, Tiesto, and Max Graham. Its not about maturing and listening too more adult like sounds. Its about knowledge expansion and learning that there is more out there and how to appreciate it all.

Thanx alot just my 2 bucks thrown hard, also a prototype to a magazine article ill be writing.

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Originally Posted by cbxzcm Maybe it's just that some people confuse "progressive" with other genres, or maybe people have different definitions of progressive. For instance, I know some people that believe a song with no vocals makes it progressive.

Let me say this. Music is made to be listened to and percieved individually. We all have are different opinions on music. The same goes for what is progressive sounding. A producer makes a track that he or she hopes will be liked but also it reflects them as a person not as a genre. It sounds more Timo Maas like than progressive. Remember "progressive is just a label". Good point tho let me clear that up. This wasnt a rant about ur reply it was different compared to most and i wanted to say something about it i liked what you said just wanted to elaborate a bit on it.

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Wow, Excellent thread.

What one person defines as "Cheese" another may define as a great track.

Exactly what is wrong with that? Just because a person likes something alot of folks don't doesn't make that person bad. For the longest time I hated trance..and then slowly started getting into it. I grew from cheese to better and better stuff.

It's the same deal for genre's as well. Alot of new trancers don't know the exactly differences between epic trance, hard trance, moving to maybe some house, techno etc. Who cares? It's about the music. If you can get down to it thats all that should matter and everyone who belittles you for liking it needs to go find a rock to hide under.

Nadi hit it on the head (You know whats a real shame? People so stuborn in there beliefs that they classifiy anyone who doesnt agree with them as n00bs, or rookies or whatever.)

So true and quite absurd that it happens.

- Deposits his 2 cents into the almsbox -

Peace,
Razer

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This is a really good post, i just wish i could formulate all the thoughts i got from reading them into a coherent message. Alas i cant. All i can say is ive gone through the same progression as most peopel have. The progression from ATB/Darude/Sonique/"Cheese" to Trance/HardTrance and now im at trancey breaks and some prog with a little bit of tech house and breakbeat for good measure. Im just really getting tired of the same uplifting stuff from all the big name djs. Its definetely a maturing of sorts, but the actual process of maturing is really sad in a way. Why? Because its sad to see my first love of trance go the way of the dinosaurs (well not completely), but its not nearly as high as it was back in 99. Why do things have to change Anywho right now im quite content with my trancey breaks and prog. Hope i dont get bored of that cause then where will i go??