I really hate to see this kind of argument. People foreseeing "the end of vinyl" and such bullshit, why start dislike good format. Vinyl is as good format as cd, sometimes better sometimes worse, depends on the use or the genre you're playing.

I play hardstyle, I use vinyl. I do some scratches and backspins on a set. Cd isn't the thing for them. I love the vinyl, the way they look and feel in my fingers. Most of the new tracks of the genre i play comes on a vinyl.

Someone plays trance I don't see the reason for using vinyl. In trance you use mostly efx on a efx unit, mixer or a cd-player not from the format. With cd you can do this just fine, vinyl wouldn't suit it any better. Cds do not take as much room as vinyls. Why to dislike them? You can get the same trance tracks in cd as you can get in vinyl. I see no point on cd-players evolving the direction of tts, why should them replace another?

Software: very decent way to start you dj-career. You can practise the basics with them. New tunes are very easy to buy online and download. But when it comes to profession i really hate to see "bigname djs" using just laptop. Of course with a ssl or fs you can do the thing there as with vinyl or cd, but complete set with just software isn't much of respect for me. I saw gabriel&dresden playing a set couple of moths ago and they just used a laptop, no tts nor cd-players, just laptop, they played one of the best sets i've ever heard, but i didn't gave them as much respect that i'd given if they've played other formats aswell.

Good djs can handle every format, good djs won't dis other formats, good djs use 2 out of 3 of these formats when play a set (or atleast one of the first two mentioned).

how about good DJs who understand how digital is destroying dance music (your superstar example being just another case and point) play RECORDS.

It is the format that has got us to this point and a few years ago when people decided to cheap out, sell out and otherwise not put in the time effort and creative energy into their productions/djing thats when it became exceptable to "play digital" and well if trance is in the shit hole situation that it is in right now I can tell you the main reason for that is because of this swing to digital. Period.

Fuck CD players, fuck laptops, fuck superstars. whatever happened to paying 8 bucks to go see some locals rip shit up on two decks with 450 people smashed into a club from doors open to doors closed (and no I am not talking "way way back in 2001" I am talking back in 1996~! in Edmonton for places on earth - that is what was going on!)???

People got fucking lazy. That's what happened. They all wanted the quick and easy path to get them somewhere and that somewhere was nowhere fast.Going back to basics, rejecting the doodads of the modern day and pushing the artform on 12" and two turntables is the ONLY way we are going to get out of this rut. otherwise say hello to the end of disco, once again.

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DJ Lithium
Black Tiger Recordings | NKME Ltd.
www.djlithium.com | www.blacktigerrecordings.com

So much anger in this one...

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Actually Lithium... I remember you berating psy trance a while ago for being majority digital based. Something about how it was full of kiddies that just liked to listen to anything trippy and download mp3s or something equally as ludicrous. At the time, I couldnt be arsed replying to it because, lets face it... if your not into it, then theres no point me trying to explain it to you.

But...

I actually sat down and had a think... surely there must be vinyl Nazi's like Lithium in the psy scene. Fuck, that scene is even more elitist than the commercial trance scene. Why has psy chosen to go digital and on doing so, making it more accessible to the unwashed masses?

then it struck me like a lightining bolt from the heavens...

.. the dust..

Outdoor parties are notorious for it. All those people stoming around in the bush. It gets into the grooves on the vinyl and wrecks the shit out of it.

So yeah... there you go... interesting eh?

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You don’t need electronic guitar in symphonic orchestra, so why would you use it? It wouldn’t make any good to it only ruin it, so why use it? You don’t need vinyl in trance, why use it? Just because everything was “vinyl only” back in 1996 wasn’t because it was better, it was just because there wasn’t much of options. Technology of DJCD-players was crap or nonexistent or rare.

But hell, the parties of 1996 were more colourful. Air was better. People were closer together. Everyone was high, took e, smoked weed or whatever. Propably weed was greener back then aswell. Nowadays everything is just so normal and appreciated by outsiders, sucks eh? It’s called the evolution. What makes a club environment worse than underground party in a warehouse? Is it because you can actually use legal stimulants like alcohol? Like the phrase on Cosmic Gate’s song “yesterday was yesterday, if you try to recapture it you will only loose tomorrow.” There were no drugs on the raves in first place, when they still were about playing, listening and dancing music. Yes I’ve been in warehouse raves, I’ve been in raves in the forest, in clubs, in big open air festivals. It isn’t the stimulants that people use, it isn’t the format people play, it is about music itself that takes me to these places.

At moment I use vinyl only, but I don’t see any reason for people using vinyl, if they don’t need to do the tricks they provide. In trance it’s more about selection, loops and efx, than about scratching or other tricks with vinyl. You still have to match the beats with CD-players like you have to when using TTs.

There have always been as much shitty songs as good ones, back in 1996 too. Maybe there weren’t as many genres as nowadays. But this “digital format is ruining the industry” is just bullshit. Do not fanaticise too much about the format you use, everyone will have their own opinion and they will use the one most suitable for their use. Remember what is not needed is useless.

450 in a club yesterday or 4500 people in a club today, can’t say much about that, but there are still UG with less people in parties, you just have to look on the right direction.

And don't dis each other, your way isn't the best way in other people's eyes. There alot of opinions, alot of point of views. Some see things different than other. Why is christianity better than buddhism. Why is buddhism better than christianity? If you don't know anything about each other why waste words for dissing. Don't get arrogant or ignorant, be open minded. Stuff happen.

That's all for now, I'm just sick'n tired for reading debates based on opinions. Try putting yourself to other peoples shoes, maybe they'll fit better?

Last edited by Specimen303 on Jun-29-2005 at 10:37

quote:

Originally posted by djlithium how about good DJs who understand how digital is destroying dance music (your superstar example being just another case and point) play RECORDS. It is the format that has got us to this point and a few years ago when people decided to cheap out, sell out and otherwise not put in the time effort and creative energy into their productions/djing thats when it became exceptable to "play digital" and well if trance is in the shit hole situation that it is in right now I can tell you the main reason for that is because of this swing to digital. Period. Fuck CD players, fuck laptops, fuck superstars. whatever happened to paying 8 bucks to go see some locals rip shit up on two decks with 450 people smashed into a club from doors open to doors closed (and no I am not talking "way way back in 2001" I am talking back in 1996~! in Edmonton for places on earth - that is what was going on!)??? People got fucking lazy. That's what happened. They all wanted the quick and easy path to get them somewhere and that somewhere was nowhere fast.Going back to basics, rejecting the doodads of the modern day and pushing the artform on 12" and two turntables is the ONLY way we are going to get out of this rut. otherwise say hello to the end of disco, once again.

The main problem is beyond formats.
It has to do with the dancemusic industry being surounded
by egocentric people who couldent possibly give a fuck
about the music.
Oakey paved the way for this shit.

It's easy to blame it on MP3's but if somebody is going to tell me that because I buy both vinyl and CDs I am destroying the music industry then there is something seriously wrong with that person.

quote:

Originally posted by harriz The main problem is beyond formats. It has to do with the dancemusic industry being surounded by egocentric people who couldent possibly give a fuck about the music. Oakey paved the way for this shit.

I have to agree, I've had the pleasure to experience the "seven year old movie star" attitude of people involved in the industry.

You should be able to use both Vinyl and CDs

I just recently bought CDJ 1000 MK2s and I can tell you that CDs sound better and are much louder and clearer than vinyl. People might say "well was it your cartidge/stylus?" well I had a pretty damn good cartridge/stylus....the Whitelabels. I can just hear the highs better, the mids and the lows, all critical points, esp those highs. Even with my headphones, it sounds better. I used to think that there was something wrong with my headphones, but now I know that vinyl, as much as it had a "warm" sound, it wasn't loud or punchy. I still need to practice with my CDJ 1000 MK2s, to kind of relearn on those, but I do not regret my purchase, or now switching to CDs. For only 1.29 a song on Beatport.com, thats pretty damn good, considering I used to pay 9.99 for one record at DanceRecords.com.

I've been spinning for 20 years and prefer vinyl.I do have a couple of cd players with all the toys but prefer to use vinyl. Only about 1% of my collection is cd's. Antonio

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antonio

quote:

Originally posted by Specimen303 There alot of opinions, alot of point of views. Some see things different than other. Why is christianity better than buddhism. Why is buddhism better than christianity? If you don't know anything about each other why waste words for dissing. Don't get arrogant or ignorant, be open minded. Stuff happen. That's all for now, I'm just sick'n tired for reading debates based on opinions. Try putting yourself to other peoples shoes, maybe they'll fit better?

This is pretty much what everyone fails to recognise. Some people like vinyl, some people like cds. Some like Sasha, some like Tiesto. Some like trance, some like hip hop. People like different things for different reasons, certain things sound good to people.

Although, if used properly an electric guitar can work wonders in a symphony setting. Metallica S&M.

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The fact that this debate still exists is actually amusing.

There are a lot of DJs out there and we all like different formats.

I actually play about 50 50 when it comes to CDs and vinyl. Still love vinyl.
I am actually looking into lap top DJing atm because I am interested where it might take me and what I can do with it in a creative sense. Not because I can DJ practically with my eyes closed, but I feel it's time to push the boundries even if they are just my own.

DJing is so much more than beatmatching two records especially in this day and age.

When your average clubber goes out they want to hear the songs they like and hear new stuff they may decide to like. They want to have fun and get excited. To think that most of them give a fuck about the format being played in is a big illusion. That's mainly anal bedroom DJs who are always going to criticise you whatever you do and think they can do a better job.

The real test of all this is out in clubland anyways...

Cheers
Nem

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https://www.mixcloud.com/Calvin_Karass/