Didn't the actress who played the oracle die sometime in between filming for revolutions? In which case her role in the third film might not be as orignially planned.

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Retro ...

yeah she died of cancer i heard. but that was after the filming of both movies.

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Originally posted by FrosT Thats incorrect. Thats to rebuild zion not the matrix. "select 23 individuals from the matrix to rebuild zion"

once again... why do the machines want zion rebuilt?


why not just kill all people who reject the matrix?



oh wait, i forgot, this is just a movie. sometimes things just can't be explained. but if you can, answer that, please.

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Originally posted by whiskers once again... why do the machines want zion rebuilt? why not just kill all people who reject the matrix? oh wait, i forgot, this is just a movie. sometimes things just can't be explained. but if you can, answer that, please.

Maybe to facilitate the function of the one such that the matrix is continually improved and it results in fewer crop losses with each version?

Or maybe the matrix within a matrix theory is correct. In which case those who seek to escape the imprisonment of the machines and fight against them are so humored and thus believe that they are in "control" when in fact they are not.

Who knows? We'll find out in November.

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Originally posted by Galapidate yeah she died of cancer i heard. but that was after the filming of both movies.

both being the first two movies. she never filmed anything for revolutions. it will be interesting to see what they do about her in the 3rd one.

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quick thing i just thought about. remember how the architect states that the first matrix failed b/c it was so perfect that the a lot of people rejected it. you think this means that the first zion was the largest? isnt it the people rejecting the world and knowing that something is wrong with it that causes them to "free their mind." i know this probably has nothign to do with the plot but it just came to me.

one more thing. so do the agents all remember the previous matrices? i would assume that they do but then again they never make any comments about dealing with neo before. do they?

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Originally posted by whitesmoke one more thing. so do the agents all remember the previous matrices? i would assume that they do but then again they never make any comments about dealing with neo before. do they?

actually, they do - the very first fight we see, when the agents say that "he is still... only human" they also mention something like "exactly like the old times", "well, not EXACTLY"


personally, i think the agents are one of the most complicated parts of the matrix, especially the way they become a subplot in Reloaded. the architect never mentions them at all and i'd expect him to.
was it obvious that the Keymaker was one of those programs that the oracle mentioned, the haywire programs that are meant for deletion? Smith was a haywire program too, but he was more than that - a virus. and no one tried to delete him.

and about the oracle, i heard someone say they might do CGI... but i REALLY doubt that's true.


and, man, what was up with merovingian and that cake scene? and the whole cause and effect stuff (which was referenced in the first part - remember the vase scene?), i think that's gonna be one of the main themes in the Revolutions


i think all 3 matrix movies would be like the Back To The Future triquel - the first one is original & innovating, the second one just continues the story, doesn't really stand on its own, and is so-so, but the third one takes the cake and blows up in your face. just a thought.

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Last edited by whiskers on Jun-09-2003 at 05:10

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Originally posted by whiskers once again... why do the machines want zion rebuilt? why not just kill all people who reject the matrix? oh wait, i forgot, this is just a movie. sometimes things just can't be explained. but if you can, answer that, please.

Ill start with the second one. The people that reject the matrix die in the process. The brain couldn't handle a perfect world hence "entire crops were lost." Zion is full of actual humans not the people who rejected the program.

For the first one I only have a couple thories everything will have to be cleared up in the final picture.

When I thought about why they want to rebuild it I had to think about why they need to destroy it. (cause and effect) The main reson i can think of is becuase they cant control the "real world" like they can the matrix. There is factors in the real world that can not be calculated without a certain margin of error. They control location but thats about the only thing they can be really sure of, the humans have to be down there. Another reason why they have to destroy it is becuase it is obviously growing to fast, that many people in one place is asking for trouble. Also becuase the matrix is based on real history whats to prevent the war between the humans and machines from starting again. A mass war would result in alot of deaths which would mean less power. Not to mention afew other reasons (neo). Now once they get down there and kill everyone why bother rebuilding it? (incoming half ass theories, no way to be sure without seeing rest) Best thing I can come up with is that they need to somehow flush out the anomally/neo, becuase he is obviously important in the restarting of the system (no way to tell exatly how at this point) As I stated earlyer they also want him in the "real wold" (if anyone actually read my long post) thats why so much control tactics are used (architect, oracle) They seem to need him out of the matrix and the only way to get him out is to use other humans to set him free. This all relys on my theory of him having to die while not connected directly into the matrix through the machines hardware(pod thing) Otherwise why didn't they kill him when they caught him in the office building in the first one? Why did they wait untill he was free before trying to off him? (There is alot of things that you can think of that make it look like they need him located and dead in the "real world" the bug thing?)

Second more simple theory is that they didn't want to change any factors from the first run through that may cause a total system failure and anihilate the power source. If they do it exacltly like they did before they get more efficient at it and have more control/power to ensure that the matrix runs smooth and they never lose power/life.

First one totally rests on neo having to die unpluged from the machines for whatever reason. Second seems more logical but still needs there to be only one matrix. I do believe there is only one matrix (see long ass post) and no matrix inside a matrix (wouldnt seem very efficient to a machine as the fake matrix people wouldnt be producing any power.

Last edited by FrosT on Jun-09-2003 at 05:11

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Originally posted by whiskers i think all 3 matrix movies would be like the Back To The Future triquel - the first one is original & innovating, the second one just continues the story, doesn't really stand on its own, and is so-so, but the third one takes the cake and blows up in your face. just a thought.

its gonna be mor elike the star wars trilogy
the first one is a self contained movie and the
2nd and 3rd are related with the second having the good guys lose and a giant cliffhanger

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Originally posted by FrosT Ill start with the second one. The people that reject the matrix die in the process. The brain couldn't handle a perfect world hence "entire crops were lost." Zion is full of actual humans not the people who rejected the program.

i see, that's what i missed. people who reject the matrix die. that explains everything.


here's another one. neo. is he really the One? is he really special, or is he made special by the fact that he had to choose between the doors (wait, i just realized something... maybe he IS SPECIAL because of the choices he makes, such as saving morpheus in part 1 and picking doors in part 2... thus the whole choice theme)

and, did the previous 5 Ones look like Neo, or were they actually different people? someone mentioned that merovingian is a former One (because of what Percephone said to Neo - "he was once just like you")

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first off, i think the matrix isn't being restarted right away...i think it takes them 24 hours. there was a preview for the third at the end of all the credits (which were really long), and i think they said something about 24 hours....or i think it was when neo saved trinity and came out of the matrix that he told morpheus that they had 24 hours.

also, when they talked about how there was only one survivor, who is the guy that got has agent smith in him or whatever, that he was the only one who survived from the three ships that were sent out to do a counter strike. i think he sabotaged the whole mission and the machines let him live. so he'll probably try to kill neo in the last one in the real world....which goes along the lines of what people have said about the machines needing to kill him in the real world and not in the computer world (matrix). but, this is only how i interpreted it after seeing it twice and wondering the same thing (is zion destroyed?).

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Originally posted by whiskers and, did the previous 5 Ones look like Neo, or were they actually different people? someone mentioned that merovingian is a former One (because of what Percephone said to Neo - "he was once just like you")

i thought the screens in the architects were the neos from before during the same conversation. that is why you saw him have the same reactions that he wanted to have at this point. then again, the architect could have changed the look of them. who knows....i dont.

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