quote:

Originally posted by Cyrus King This is the funniest thing ive read all week. Basic cntradiction. How are they using "anti-democratic" means to go against the governement, when they are using the very DEMOCRATIC doctrine of free speech to show their condemnation in serving in the IDF? They probably knew that they could have stated something "psychological" but they were brave enough to tell the TRUTH about their feelings. By taking advantage of Isreal's so called "free speech" they were put in jail.

Good reply, Cyrus.

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Theodore Herzl, founder of the World Zionist Organization: "Spirit the penniless population across the frontier by denying it employment... Both the process of expropriation and the removal of the poor must be carried out discreetly and circumspectly."

quote:

Originally posted by Cyrus King This is the funniest thing ive read all week. Basic cntradiction. How are they using "anti-democratic" means to go against the governement, when they are using the very DEMOCRATIC doctrine of free speech to show their condemnation in serving in the IDF? They probably knew that they could have stated something "psychological" but they were brave enough to tell the TRUTH about their feelings. By taking advantage of Isreal's so called "free speech" they were put in jail.

NO!

Dont forget that democracy is also based on laws, if i steal money from the bank - i should be put in jail, cause i go against the law that is agreed by the wide majority.
they can protest, they can vote for leaders that share their idiological ideas (and there are), they can join a political party and run for parliment after the service, but what they did was simply a cheap performance , proud to show the whole world how they oppose the law and support their country's enemies.

why i say they idiots? beacuse it is my opinion ofcourse. calling someone an idiot is not a fact you can base or contradict. and why i think so? because they exploited the media for cheap political provocation that also hurts Israel.

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Best Album Ever:
* Infected Mushroom - B.P.Empire

quote:

Originally posted by Flotser NO! Dont forget that democracy is also based on laws, if i steal money from the bank - i should be put in jail, cause i go against the law that is agreed by the wide majority.

democracy once didnt allow blacks to vote, and it was the LAW!!! Doesnt mean its right. These students gave legitemate reasons for their condemnation of the IDF, but people like you see them as betrayers.

quote:

they can protest, they can vote for leaders that share their idiological ideas (and there are), they can join a political party and run for parliment after the service, but what they did was simply a cheap performance , proud to show the whole world how they oppose the law and support their country's enemies.

They have the freedom to do all these "POLITICAL" decisions, then why can they not voice their "POLITICAL" opinions on this matter? You once again contradicted yourself. BAsically lets silence anyone from our camp if they have siomething negative and constructive to say.

Again, this extensive labelling program by Israeli's is getting really tiresome....i wouldnt be surprised if you started saying they were terrorists...lame attempt at explaining their position really.

quote:

why i say they idiots? beacuse it is my opinion ofcourse. calling someone an idiot is not a fact you can base or contradict. and why i think so? because they exploited the media for cheap political provocation that also hurts Israel.

How is it cheap? Again you just label their very serious opinions as a "cheap" exploitation without explaining yourself. Face it buddy,, there are some Israeli's that are also disgusted by the occupation...they exist becuase they know the realities that palestinians face. Fortunately, they arent blinded by patriotism and excessive indoctrination.

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"This place isn't big enough for me to blow it up."
-MARCO V

quote:

Originally posted by Cyrus King democracy once didnt allow blacks to vote, and it was the LAW!!! Doesnt mean its right. These students gave legitemate reasons for their condemnation of the IDF, but people like you see them as betrayers.

how can you compare serving in the army and black people slavery??
you dont know much about israeli laws though so i wont get into this anyway.

quote:

They have the freedom to do all these "POLITICAL" decisions, then why can they not voice their "POLITICAL" opinions on this matter? You once again contradicted yourself. BAsically lets silence anyone from our camp if they have siomething negative and constructive to say.

Thats exactly where you dont understand me. noone says they CANT voice their political opinions on this metter, and noone silences them. i've never said that. but why i think they are idiots? because in order to state their political opinion they hurt their own country and they dont give a fuck about all the other soldiers\retired soldiers\femelies of soldiers - their main care is passing the whole world their "progressive" approach.

how?
Its a very stable & undoubtable fact after all the wars israel went threw (escpecially 73 war that came as a total surprise in Jews most sacred day of the year) that Israel needs this obligatory army.
Think about a mother that "sends" its 18 sons to risk their lifes serving the country and protecting it for 3 years (believe it or not). and now come those nice "proggressive" guys and call the army (including her sons) in the same names Hammas calls it. if they had done that threw normal democratic\political channels it was better accepted, but they also run away from service. IMO, if you escape from service for watever reasons atleast keep it low, show some respect!!
yes - they can do what they did. and one year in prison was almost their decision..... its not that bad realy, instead of serving 3 years.
me - think they are idiots.

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Again, this extensive labelling program by Israeli's is getting really tiresome....i wouldnt be surprised if you started saying they were terrorists...lame attempt at explaining their position really.

quote:

How is it cheap? Again you just label their very serious opinions as a "cheap" exploitation without explaining yourself. Face it buddy,, there are some Israeli's that are also disgusted by the occupation...they exist becuase they know the realities that palestinians face. Fortunately, they arent blinded by patriotism and excessive indoctrination.

not only they exist, they also share alot of chairs in the isreali parliment - jews & muslims. thats the difference realy, while under the FLO\Fattah and Hamas rule people like this get murdered on the streets (i can search for articles on the issue).

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Best Album Ever:
* Infected Mushroom - B.P.Empire

quote:

Originally posted by Palestinian If you care about your precious Israel, you would stop being occupiers and get the fuck off someone else' land. The only thing doing the recruiting is your American made tanks and helicopter gunships above our homes and streets.

awwwww

so sad

me go cry now

me so sad when homocidal maniac gets shot

miso soup

awwwwww

quote:

Originally posted by Dopey miso soup

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"Those are my principles, if you don't like them... well, I have others.”

quote:

Originally posted by Dopey awwwww so sad me go cry now me so sad when homocidal maniac gets shot miso soup awwwwww

nice homocidal maniac

moron

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"This place isn't big enough for me to blow it up."
-MARCO V

quote:

Originally posted by Cyrus King nice homocidal maniac moron

do we really need cheap propaganda like that?

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"Those are my principles, if you don't like them... well, I have others.”

quote:

Originally posted by TranceGiant do we really need cheap propaganda like that?

and if it were an Israeli, would it still be cheap?

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"This place isn't big enough for me to blow it up."
-MARCO V

quote:

Originally posted by Cyrus King and if it were an Israeli, would it still be cheap?

I prefer written arguments to a bunch of pics, no matter from what side. In such debates pictures do not "say more than a 1000 words" but are misleading and never tell the whole truth. Their only use is that of propaganda by provoking emotion instead of thought.

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"Those are my principles, if you don't like them... well, I have others.”

The difference is not the nationality of the child.

In one, the child is a collateral casualty (read: accidental) when the IDF attempts to stop future terror attacks.

In the other, the child is targeted by a terrorist.

The terrorist intends the child to die. The proper soldier does not.

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FLUSHED THE JOHNS!

quote:

Originally posted by imokruok The difference is not the nationality of the child. In one, the child is a collateral casualty (read: accidental) when the IDF attempts to stop future terror attacks. In the other, the child is targeted by a terrorist. The terrorist intends the child to die. The proper soldier does not.

When four times as many people are dying on the Palestinian side, i fail to understand how you can label the IDF as trying to "stop future terror attacks".

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"This place isn't big enough for me to blow it up."
-MARCO V