I can't wait to get back to NY to check out Crobar and Avalon... gotta wait till the summer though

The following is my opinion:

1) Line-up they get not including Twilo of course (RIP):
a) Spundae@1015 (When they had their Friday and Sunday shows going, the talent at 1015 was unheard of)
b) Centro-fly/Arc (Although it seems like Centro may be dropping off as of late)
c) Guvernment/Release@1015/Stereo (not as consistent with the rest for their talent)

2) Quality of Sound:
I can't give an unbiased opinion of the Guv here (read my other post in this thread). Other than that, Shelter, Centro-fly, Sona, 1015 all sound great to me.


3) People
a) Club 6ix (Still my favorite place to party in SF... saw Taylor in their dungeon of a basement with the 75 most amazing people I have ever partied with... not sure if they are still throwing techno parties anymore... they typically have hip-hop there)
b) Guvernment/Spundae@1015/Centro-fly (I always found the guv to be real hit or miss... some nights the crowd was awesome, and then other nights you get a real annoying Gino crowd that bring down the coolness of the place and the fun people there... As for Spundae here, this only applies to their big Sunday parties and not their Friday parties... there is a tremendous difference in the coolness of the people at both parties... Friday's aren't fun anymore cause the people suck... it used to be the place pre 2000, but alot of the cool people moved away when they lost their jobs... as for Centro, I found the people to be fun every night but their Thursday parties used to be my fav)
b) Everyone else is a distant second.

4) Decor
a) Guvernment/Centro-fly (no argument here except that Guv is so much bigger so they can do more things to the club compared to Centro).
b) Meow (no longer open)
c) Club 6ix (j/k... anyone that has seen this place and the neighborhood it resides in would take a dump in their pants... real ghetto)

After all that my personal favorite club to party in is Spundae@1015 at their Sunday parties. I look at all times I went to their Sunday parties and my most memorable clubbing experiences always came from there. The music was always perfect and the crowd was so much fun to party with. You can't name another club in North America that can have Cass & Lee Burridge spinning in one room, Jerry Bonham in another, and Erick Morillo tearing a new hole into the main room all at the same time. Not to mention that Spundae was named #1 at Dancestar a few years back (excluding Canadian club of course)

I also love Centro-fly with a passion. For the time I spent in NY, I almost never missed a Thursday party. Awesome people, awesome music... a recipe for clubbing success.

I do like the Guv alot but I find it to be way too streaky with the crowd. However, when the crowd is on, it's really hard to beat... I find Canadian clubbers to be more laid back and fun to party with than the majority of American clubbers (based on personal experience)... It could be a reason why the crowd at the Guv is so cool.

All that being said avikonen, have you ever been to the Guv on a night when you could tell the crowd just wasn't the same as usual? When every other girl is a plastic-surgery barbie doll and every other guy a juiced up Gino? After experiencing a bunch of those nights I lost alot of respect for the place.

-Your Mother

btw avikonen, have you partied at any clubs in Miami? I could see Space being up there too... just haven't made it down there yet.

All in due time.

-Your Mother

Spunday@1015Folsom and the SF scene in general is really good. The scene took a big hit with the economy and the busts at 1015 I still give Guv the nod. I think Canadians are cooler people to party with I have not had a bad night at Guv. I'm sure that when it happens I may feel less enthused about that place, but so far so good

I've been to Space34 for WMC but not the original Space which I heard was amazing!

quote:

Originally posted by Your Mother btw avikonen, have you partied at any clubs in Miami? I could see Space being up there too... just haven't made it down there yet. All in due time. -Your Mother

quote:

Originally posted by avikonen Spunday@1015Folsom and the SF scene in general is really good. The scene took a big hit with the economy and the busts at 1015 I still give Guv the nod. I think Canadians are cooler people to party with I have not had a bad night at Guv. I'm sure that when it happens I may feel less enthused about that place, but so far so good I've been to Space34 for WMC but not the original Space which I heard was amazing!

"The scene took a big hit with the economy and the busts at 1015"

Precisely... G did some real damage to the entire scene out there.

-Your Mother

For someone who's been away from the club for four years, you sure have a lot to say Mother!!!

quote:

Originally posted by Your Mother I returned to the Guv for the first time in about 4 years on new years and I was very dissapointed with the music. Phazon or no phazon, it sounded like crap... way too much bass and it sounded like it needed to be tweaked by someone who knows what they are doing. Anybody who partied at Twilo back in the day can tell you just how crisp the phazon system can be. Also, I used to respect Mark Oliver as a Dj, but his new years set is giving me second thoughts... His style was all over the place and his track selection seemed random at best. He tried mixing progressive tracks into trance into hard house and then back again without any type of logical progression to the tracks he was using to bridge the gap. I would call his set uninspired at best. Furthermore, Guv could do alot better than ramming Mark Oliver down your throat every weekend... They do bring in some talent, but its nowhere near what they are capable of. A club of that size should be bringing in top Dj's every weekend and could still charge a max of $25 at the door, but they choose to soak everyone cause they know people are still willing to pay. If Boa can bring in consistent talent then it may force Guv to do more of the same but at reasonable price... It sickens me the number of people who are willing to pay $50 to see Oakenfold spin for 2 hours when the club is rammed to the gills. His sets almost always suck live, and no Dj is worth that kind of money if you ask me. Sorry for the venting, but I hate watching clubs operate with the sole purpose of making as much money as possible and not offering a worthwhile experience to their patrons. -Your Mother.

many ppl find the experience worthwhile. if you disagree then don't go. the place packs it in really nice on amny given saturday.

as for price. you can't beat the guv. yes, it will be more expensive for some special events, but on a regular night it is incredible value. clubs in mtl and in the states have cover of over 20 cdn (in mtl) and 20 american.

and as for MO, I was at stereo in mtl for new years so i didn't catch his set, but he is an amazingly versatile DJ who I have enjoyed and been surprised by on many occasions. the man can spin anything. (did you know that he had an electro set at elements a few months ago). if you are judging mark from one set and you haven't heard him in 4 years then I can't really give any value to your comments. I have heard him play more sets than i can count over the past 4 years. he is truly an amazing DJ and we are lucky to have him.

guv doesn't have to charge 25 bucks. look at the talent they are bringing in for ultra 4! and what they are charging. most ppl would disagree w/ your comment about having mark 'rammed down our throats' if you look at the guv message board, many of the patrons actually prefer a resident night w/ mark b/c they want to experience a nice long set from him. The man deserves our respect he has an amazing set of skills.

I think those in favour of keeping the Guvernment open make valid points, but it's time to close it and move on. I've had amazing nights there, they DO get great djs in so I'm not bitching or complaining about the Guvernment, but in order for the Toronto scene to evolve (and I think we all can agree it needs a facelift) then closing it is the best thing that can happen.. not short term, but in the long run.

This club has gotten so big that it monopolizes the entire scene. Not only do new promoters not stand a chance, but the Guvernment does nothing to support the influx of burgeoning young dj talent this city has to offer.. for the last 7 years they've had the same dj in every night to play 8 hours. There is SO much dj talent (on this very board alone) that will never get a shot at playing the Guvernment, but since everyone goes there on Saturdays anyway, any other gig they play on a Saturday won't get the exposure it deserves. The shows they have there have a direct effect on turnouts up to a week or two later, not necessarily even the same night!

The Guvernment is no doubt a world class club but we've gotten too comfortable with it; we won't even go out and give other clubnights (big and small, local and international) a chance. People go to that club these days because everyone else is there and they know what to expect; also to be seen and look good; limos showing up in the parking lot and stuff.. it's all about glamour these days, not about the music at all. And frankly, for the last 2 years, Toronto really has missed the point. It's become completely pretentious. People can blame it on the overcapacity, but I think the main reason why true music lovers are tired of the Guvernment is because the actual people that go there that have more appreciation for sex and drugs than music. (although I'm not against either of the other 2

It's easy to think that we'll never see the talent the Guvernment gets in if they close, but clubs do come and go. Aside from that, international djs LOVE Toronto, the Guvernment isn't the only club that can attract big djs.

It's time for something to happen in Toronto, and although it may seem crazy, the Guvernment closing is the best thing that can happen for our community to grow and move on.

___________________

BRING ON CIRCA!!
www.djdennishahn.com

I totally see where you are coming from dennis, but i diagree on a few points. if the guv closed i think it would be bad for the scene. as you mentioned a lot of the ppl that go there, go there eb/c they think it is the place to be for the activities that they want to partake in, not b/c of the music. they don't come out to see dj's they go out to party only. but w/o those ppl paying their 10 or 15 bucks then Guv couldn't bring in the kind of talent that it does. Our scene is no longer massive enough to support many venues, yet the scene in europe is still big so if our scene was more underground we couldn't afford to bring in many of the DJ's that actual music fans want to see.
I would love to see a scene where new promoters and new DJ's could flourish. I wish that Guv would utilize the orange room or one of the other smaller rooms to host up and comers the way system does with the VIP. Maybe that will happend some day.

dance music itself has been on a downward slope for teh past few years, once this whole fake-punk craze dies down, i'm hoping that a new incarnation of teh dance scene will evolve and your vision could be realized, whether the guv was still open or not.

quote:

Originally posted by charmscars many ppl find the experience worthwhile. if you disagree then don't go. the place packs it in really nice on amny given saturday. as for price. you can't beat the guv. yes, it will be more expensive for some special events, but on a regular night it is incredible value. clubs in mtl and in the states have cover of over 20 cdn (in mtl) and 20 american. and as for MO, I was at stereo in mtl for new years so i didn't catch his set, but he is an amazingly versatile DJ who I have enjoyed and been surprised by on many occasions. the man can spin anything. (did you know that he had an electro set at elements a few months ago). if you are judging mark from one set and you haven't heard him in 4 years then I can't really give any value to your comments. I have heard him play more sets than i can count over the past 4 years. he is truly an amazing DJ and we are lucky to have him. guv doesn't have to charge 25 bucks. look at the talent they are bringing in for ultra 4! and what they are charging. most ppl would disagree w/ your comment about having mark 'rammed down our throats' if you look at the guv message board, many of the patrons actually prefer a resident night w/ mark b/c they want to experience a nice long set from him. The man deserves our respect he has an amazing set of skills.

I used to party at the Guv all the time between 98 and 99 and if I was still in TO it would be my number one club of choice... I have friends in TO that have been going to spin saturday's religously since day 1 before the place started to get packed and they all agree that Mark 's sets are very spotty. Some times he will tear the place down, and other times you will find better music in the Orange room or the drink... case in point for the new years party. Everyone I met that night thought Sydney Blu should have been playing the main room and Mark the orange simply because Mark wasn't doing it for them.

It's not that I don't like Mark, but I think they need to bring in a better rotation of top resident's there. It would keep the place fresh and give up and coming talent a chance to shine in front of so many people.

My opinion of course... and like I said, I do love the Guv and still look forward to partying there... I just think they need to change it up... Furthermore, everytime I am abroad I make a point to tell everyone about the place cause it deserves alot of respect on the global clubbing circuit.

-Your Mother

quote:

Originally posted by Your Mother I used to party at the Guv all the time between 98 and 99 and if I was still in TO it would be my number one club of choice... I have friends in TO that have been going to spin saturday's religously since day 1 before the place started to get packed and they all agree that Mark 's sets are very spotty. Some times he will tear the place down, and other times you will find better music in the Orange room or the drink... case in point for the new years party. Everyone I met that night thought Sydney Blu should have been playing the main room and Mark the orange simply because Mark wasn't doing it for them. It's not that I don't like Mark, but I think they need to bring in a better rotation of top resident's there. It would keep the place fresh and give up and coming talent a chance to shine in front of so many people. My opinion of course... and like I said, I do love the Guv and still look forward to partying there... I just think they need to change it up... Furthermore, everytime I am abroad I make a point to tell everyone about the place cause it deserves alot of respect on the global clubbing circuit. -Your Mother

fair enough. I agree that mark is better on some nights than others, but i think that in terms of DJ's he is very consistant. his opener for digweed at lotus was brilliant as was his closing for marco v in june. it would be nice to see some rotating residents or for them to utilize the smaller rooms for local talent more than they are doing. I do think that MO is the perfect choice for a Guv resident tho, b/c he IS very versatile. Any DJ has on and off nights. My favorite DJ (Lawler) played amazingly the last 2 times but the time before wasn't so great.

Okay well last I heard was that Charles was going to sell the Guv to MGM Studio's for $16 million. I also heard that the IF this is going to happen it won't be for another year at least........
I love the Guvernment and go whenever I can and would hate to see it close down. There is just one thing to remember if the Guv does close Charles will buy another place and start it all again......... Toronto has a great scene and even better it has a great people who love to party......so wether the Guv stays open or not Toronto will always be a GREAT place to party!

This has turned into quite the thread! Very good points made on both sides of the coin.

Maybe someone should start a poll to further facilitate discussion?

itikia