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| quote: | Originally posted by Dervish
Look you can't do that you simply can't. What your taking about is as ineffective as it is obsene. Your completely off your head. Seriously. You need a morality injection. You seriously think these terroist cells are known to the locals??? The are blowing up the locals you absolute idiot. I don't normally use that type of language in an arguement but what your proposing is unbelivable.
EDIT: So a terroist cells in New York, and you don't know where it is...... have same locals hanging from the traffic lights and the cell will give up???   Your an utter nutter. |
Terrorists don't materialize out of thin air, they have to recruit new members. And that means they have to maintain some degree of contact with the community in which they exist. Do you seriously believe that a terrorist cell can exist within a community completely unbeknownst to any member of that community outside the terrorist cell itself? That's what the terrorists would like us to believe, I'm sure. But it's clearly beyond the realm of the possible.
| quote: | Originally posted by Deejiuana
I must agree with the morality injection because u do need one. If you really think that u should eliminate an entire race because of the risk that they might one day join some terrorist activities then oh boy, am outta here....seriously. Anyway, this isnt really surprising, i've heard this bs before...lol.
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I never claimed we should eliminate an entire race. I grow weary of your attempts to straw man my argument.
| quote: | Originally posted by dukes
not true history has shown that upon being attacked people defend themselfs in the most instinctual way...attack back. in past wars even the greatest war leaders have found problems killing people on there home ground.
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Nonsense, history is littered with examples of people being brutalized into submission. Are the Native Americans attacking all the European invaders currently residing in North America? Hardly.
Even the Arabs themselves were crushed and battered to the point where they could no longer resist by the Mongols. In fact I'd go so far as to suggest that every populated area on this planet has been completely and utterly dominated by a superior military force at one point in time or another.
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i think you are a tad blured here too..
there is a differance between alouing them to be killed as you put it and what we actualy do which is try to prevent them being killed without further loss of life. to alou them to be killed would mean we actualy take no active part in atempting to prevent this happening. what we do is use intelegance and other methods to prevent the deaths of inocents while sticking to the western ideology of not killing neadlessly.
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If I believed that there were any "active part[s] in attempting to prevent this [from] happening" that we could take that would be effective other than the strategy I am proposing, I would agree with you. However, it is my belief upon considering the available evidence that no other methodology will prevent the deaths of innocents to a greater extent than short-term brutality. I fully support the western ideology of not killing needlessly - but it is with the deepest regret that I can not view killing in this situation as needless.
If any of you would like to propose a realistic alternative to my proposal which would actually put a stop to, rather than just minimizing, terrorism, I'd love to hear it.
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again slightly simplistic way of putting it...
you are corect it is not hard to create bombs and run round blowing stuff up. what is hard is being able to run around and blow things up if you are known to be in the terrorist steriotype. this is easy to see as if you were to look into how many terrorist attacks have been prevented compaired to how many have taken place you will find that its only a small percentage of atempts that are successful.
yes these terrorist types can be found. they DO all fit into a sterio type if they did not then security forces and intelegance services would not be having the success they are.
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It might be more difficult if you fit the terrorist stereotype, but that's really beside the point. The longer terrorism is allowed to exist in the world as an ideology, the more likely other groups will begin to adapt it. Already, it is not a practice exclusive to Arabs or any other ethnic or racial group. The longer we put off taking decisive action, the greater the foothold terrorism will gain in the politics of the times, and the more damage we will have to cause in order to remove it, not to mention the more innocents who will needlessly die in the meantime.
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like i said above we are more blessed that our governments are pretty good at prevention. |
Yes, but will they be able to maintain the same degree of success if white or hispanic organizations start using terrorism to advance their cause? You said yourself that "if they did not [fit into a stereotype] then security forces and intelligences services would not be having the success they are," so clearly the answer is no. If we do not eliminate terrorism, it will only become more common - do you not realize this?
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again as i said earlier they will be far more likely to attack back than join our side.
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They will quickly realize that "to attack back" is futile and will only increase the intensity of their suffering. There are many people with strong convictions, but many more who will do anything to stay alive. What you're suggesting - that somehow each and every terrorist or "person of the same ethnicity of a terrorist" will somehow band together to protect themselves - is not substantiated by history. History consistently shows that people will resist when provoked, but that sooner or later they will break. These people are no different.
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of course al qaeda is not the be all and end all but right now they are acheaving far more than any other terrorist organisation. hence this makes them the greatest threat and so they take priority over any others.
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I agree that they should take priority at this time. But slowly chipping away at their infrastructure is not going to have a significant effect to prevent the perpetuation of the terrorist ideology. It is not an effective way to eliminate terrorism.
| quote: | Originally posted by ahlamalek
Arbiter you take a very logical and cold stance which in the real world does not work...
sorry.
It must be fun thinking these ideas out in your basement in hickville.
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No need to apologize, ahlamalek, but I can't say that it is fun.
Believe me, I would like nothing else than to have a different stance with regards to this issue. Unfortunately, unlike many people, who seem to believe whatever they want to believe, my personality forces me to believe whatever appears to follow logically from the evidence at hand. Nothing would please me more than to be able to believe that there were a more peaceful resolution to the problems of terrorism. However, if there is one, I cannot see it.
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Hard to believe thats your opinion..! There are enough examples where this is not the case! Think of the Nazis in WWII where often 100 civilians were killed because Partisans killed ONE single german soldier!
